NY's Vindictive Plans for carry - special session next week to respond to SCOTUS's ruling. (Merged)

[Steal2B]

My only point was that you appeared to be using live fire training statistics while he was talking about training in general. Further, he qualified his statement with "...as far as I know", meaning that it was his belief and not to be taken as fact. It seemed to me as if you were just piling on.

I'm well aware of what Pennsylvania requires. I've had a PA permit for almost 30 years. I have permits from other States as well. Some originally required training, but accepted proof of military service in lieu of their prescribed course.

I did not start with any pile on. I posted a simple graphic which supported @Edwardteach72 point.

I only posted more info after being accused of cherry picking in a long winded response.

every state that requires a license to carry has a training requirement to my knowledge

When about 40% of the States that require a carry permit have no training requirement at all, saying "every state" just seems quite inaccurate even with the "to my knowledge" qualifier.

 

[spat]

The bitch slap from SCOTUS will indeed be the catalyst that gets it built.

You could very well be right.

But I think it's going to wait till someone figures out how to get a sufficient kickback.

 

[Steal2B]

You could very well be right.

But I think it's going to wait till someone figures out how to get a sufficient kickback.

And the kickback may be paid by ...

"Brooklyn Sen. Andrew Gounardes and Albany Assemblywoman Pat Fahy have introduced a bill that would impose a new five-cent per-round tax on all ammunition .22 caliber or greater, with a two-cent per-round tax on .22 ammo and smaller projectiles."

 

[Steal2B]

. The training requirement has been and likely will remain upheld.

You are correct if NY stays in the pack but the vindictive left may push the envelope too far. For example the now unneeded permit training in Texas (I think I remember it was just one morning for training and live fire testing) was far less stringent than what the governor is suggesting.

One could even argue when the training required to exercise a 2A right far exceeds the requirements to operate a motor vehicle (which statistics can show is more dangerous or deadly) the state can be more vulnerable to legal infringement challenge.

 

[Acer-m14]

1934 to 2022 .. is nothing .. compared to 1776 to 1934 ..

please explain the training needed from 1776 to 1934 ?

 

[spat]

And the kickback may be paid by ...

"Brooklyn Sen. Andrew Gounardes and Albany Assemblywoman Pat Fahy have introduced a bill that would impose a new five-cent per-round tax on all ammunition .22 caliber or greater, with a two-cent per-round tax on .22 ammo and smaller projectiles."

So, only guns for rich people then. How progressive of them.

Ask them how much their tax would raise the cost of a drive by or mass shooting, and if they think the extra $5 is going to discourage anyone?

 

[spat]

Where do I buy a large banner that says "Concealed carry is welcome here". I need to hang it from the roof of my business.

Just put a guy on the door to make sure everyone is armed...

 

[spat]

okay ,, lets just say the NYS Fair is a sensitive place .. and LEO is there ..

OKAY . then there better be a LEO for every person there as a personal armed escort ..

My theory is anywhere that guns are banned, the party banning them should assume the duty to protect anyone there.

So, while you can't sue the cops for an attack in the street, you can if it happens in the court house after the metal detectors....

Some guy wants to post the "no guns" sign at his vegan coffee shop, he assumes a duty to defend you.

 

[spat]

Live fire training and just training in general are two different things.

I do not know how many States require some form of training, but using only live fire training statistics to prove your point or to disprove his doesn't work.

Since half the states are constitutional carry, I can say for sure most do not have a training requirement.

 

[NY Chamorro]

I thought "safe storage" laws were already thrown out?

appendix carry is concidered safe storage, correct?

 

[spat]

1934 to 2022 .. is nothing .. compared to 1776 to 1934 ..

please explain the training needed from 1776 to 1934 ?

For the beginning there you were expected to show up for training and bring your own ammo and military style rifle.

That was not a requirement to be allowed to carry, it was a requirement if you were a military aged male.

Think if everyone registered for selective service was required to show up for an afternoon once a month with their own rifle and a few mags of ammo.

 

[spat]

I hope that surfices for what they are asking for. These [censored] will do stuff just to annoy like say 20 hours of additional training.

I wouldn't put it past them to require 20 hours of gender sensitivity training. They DGAF about your skill with a firearm, they just want to be a PITA.

 

[Acer-m14]

For the beginning there you were expected to show up for training and bring your own ammo and military style rifle.

That was not a requirement to be allowed to carry, it was a requirement if you were a military aged male.

Think if everyone registered for selective service was required to show up for an afternoon once a month with their own rifle and a few mags of ammo.

didn't need a permit from the govt back then first ... to bring your arms and powder and balls and 5 references

 

[spat]

didn't need a permit from the govt back then first ... to bring your arms and powder and balls and 5 references

nope.

Didn't have any training requirement either, since *everyone* was required to get training.

If they just included live fire gun safety training in the requirement for a high school diploma (make gym class useful), then they don't need to have the permit at all. Your high school diploma is your permit.

Not that I agree with even that level of restriction, but it would be far more reasonable than what we have now.

 

[Shadow rider]

Are there vegan options available for tar and feathers? Something non fossil fuel and Gretta approved? Hemp rope?

How about honey and an ant hill?

 

[Cavalry]

• “Require a background check to purchase ammunition for a gun that requires a permit”
  We already got ass raped to get the permit why would we need another god dammed background check for ammo

And they know the ammunition is for a pistol how? Marlin Camp9 is a nice fuddy looking carbine, no permit required to posess even thought it eats 9x19.
Just about ever modern "pistol" caliber has a complimentary carbine that uses it.

 

[spat]

And they know the ammunition is for a pistol how? Marlin Camp9 is a nice fuddy looking carbine, no permit required to posess even thought it eats 9x19.
Just about ever modern "pistol" caliber has a complimentary carbine that uses it.

Either that or they go the other way and anything anyone makes a handgun for.

So you'll be able to buy 50bmg without a permit, but that's about it (see how they handled the armor piercing ammunition prohibition)

 

[spat]

How about honey and an ant hill?

There's always pine tar and poison ivy....

 

[nortatoga]

Well cool but you're wrong..

He is not totally wrong, and yes a lot of these states (25) are now constitutional carry. But with History, Text and Tradition training is or was required.

Permit Training Requirements By State

www.concealedcarry.com

 

[nortatoga]

Perhaps VA has changed their laws since I held a permit there around 2007, but at that time there was a requirement for live-fire training, and I had to qualify. In the end, you are cherry-picking one or two things but the premise stands. The training requirement has been and likely will remain upheld. States can require it if they want. And those states that require a permit, do they not require at least classroom work? That was more what I was talking about, I only mentioned the live-fire training as it pertained to me in the states I held a permit.

You are correct, from the link I posted above (#168)

Any in-person firearm training course qualifies. [Updated Jan 1st, 2021]

 

[99cummins]

Some guy wants to post the "no guns" sign at his vegan coffee shop, he assumes a duty to defend you.

The perp would voluntarily leave or eat his own firearm after 2 minutes of “this is why vegans are the best and meat is murder. Try this new vegan milk…”

 

[Drinkthekoolaid]

Live fire training and just training in general are two different things.

I do not know how many States require some form of training, but using only live fire training statistics to prove your point or to disprove his doesn't work.

My frustrations with live fire testing to get a license, is how in the hell can someone practice live firing to be prepared for the live fire evaluation when they can't fire a pistol in this state without their license.



Also I heard beaver faces newest super genius moment. She wants to "default" all private property to gun free zones and you can only carry by law on that property if there is a sign clearly showing concealed carry is welcome.


This state sucks.

 

[Edwardteach72]

He is not totally wrong, and yes a lot of these states (25) are now constitutional carry. But with History, Text and Tradition training is or was required.

Permit Training Requirements By State

www.concealedcarry.com

He said all states that had licenses required training.. PA off the top of my head doesn't require any training at all.

 

[nortatoga]

He said all states that had licenses required training.. PA off the top of my head doesn't require any training at all.

True and I said "He is not totally wrong"

The link I posted shows 7 states that don't/ didn't require training

 

[Steal2B]

And they know the ammunition is for a pistol how? Marlin Camp9 is a nice fuddy looking carbine, no permit required to posess even thought it eats 9x19.
Just about ever modern "pistol" caliber has a complimentary carbine that uses it.

Well, semi-auto rifles are now permitted in NY with the new vindictive infringements. Article 400 of the Penal law was amended (S.9458/A.10503) to create a new type of gun license called a license for a semiautomatic rifle.


As for carbines like a 357 mag Henry H012mx that are not semi-automatic, remember the posts on this fine forum about Dicks Sporting Goods where they would not sell 357, 38 special, or even 22lr unless a pistol permit was shown? Yeah there may be may be a bunch of fun threads about ammo sale infringements again.

Thread '..."Show me your Permit"!!...buying ammo' ..."Show me your Permit"!!...buying ammo

And some forum old timers may have fun strolling down memory lane with this one

Dicks Sporting Goods Ammo and NYS Law

www.nyfirearms.com

 

[nortatoga]

My frustrations with live fire testing to get a license, is how in the hell can someone practice live firing to be prepared for the live fire evaluation when they can't fire a pistol in this state without their license.



Also I heard beaver faces newest super genius moment. She wants to "default" all private property to gun free zones and you can only carry by law on that property if there is a sign clearly showing concealed carry is welcome.


This state sucks.

NY is going to have to rewrite most if not all of Penal 400.00

 

[Edwardteach72]

True and I said "He is not totally wrong"

The link I posted shows 7 states that don't/ didn't require training

I mean he is by saying "all"

 

[nortatoga]

I mean he is by saying "all"

Yes I understand that.

 

[Edwardteach72]

Yes I understand that.

Also side note, am I the only one who caught how he claimed no state had background checks on ammo purchases "not even California"..........

Checks notes... Rhode v Becerra......

 

[nortatoga]

Also side note, am I the only one who caught how he claimed no state had background checks on ammo purchases "not even California"..........

Checks notes... Rhode v Becerra......

He did say that.