Trump Kills Biden’s ‘Ridiculous’ Auto Mileage Standards

SonOfSun · Sep 27, 2026

Free market will push that way anyways. With gas tipping towards $5/gal, the consumers will want fuel efficient vehicles. Those that make them will outsell and profit over competitors that don't.

SonOfSun · Sep 27, 2026

livingston said:
People will fore go fuel efficiency to some extent if they can get a vehicle that will last more than a typical warranty period . Case in point ... Will a car with a turbo last 10 - 15 years with out a major engine repair . The main reason a turbo is in a small car is for more fuel efficiency ...

Hyundai Overtakes Ford as Hybrid Boom Reshapes US Auto Market

Cox Automotive projects Hyundai, Kia, and Genesis will outsell Ford in the third quarter as hybrid demand continues shifting the competitive landscape.

www.autoweek.com

The market will decide. Always has.

OwnTheRide · Sep 27, 2026

The thing is, gas goes up, people buy more electric, causing demand for gas to drop, and with it price... so people buy more ICE vehicles. Round and round we go.

Electric still has a long way to go in terms of longevity and viability before I even consider it. I tend to drive vehicles until the rust has eaten the body away to the point that it looks like Fred Flintstone's vehicle.

holdover · Sep 27, 2026

electric has shitty resale value . Id rather drive an old jeep or pickup , one of the reasons trump did that was because the average joe was struggling to buy a 50K vehicle .

spat · Sep 28, 2026

SonOfSun said:
Free market will push that way anyways. With gas tipping towards $5/gal, the consumers will want fuel efficient vehicles. Those that make them will outsell and profit over competitors that don't.

The key is that "consumers" aren't a monolithic block and shouldn't be treated as such.

Many will flock to the econoboxes as you say. But other people have wants and needs that justify the higher fuel costs of a less efficient vehicle.

Government has no business trying to sort out who "needs" the larger or more powerful vehicle.

Drinkthekoolaid · Sep 28, 2026

Toyota recently updated the engines on their camry and RAV4, the only choice now is a hybrid, it's standard and there is no alternative and they are in the ~50mpg ballpark.

They have not been able to produce them fast enough, they are sold before they ever reach a dealers lot.

Cavalry · Sep 28, 2026

SonOfSun said:
Free market will push that way anyways. With gas tipping towards $5/gal, the consumers will want fuel efficient vehicles. Those that make them will outsell and profit over competitors that don't.

Let me know when people stop buying SUVs and full size pickup trucks as commute vehicles and I will believe that.

I am all about giving consumers fuel efficient choices. Lets start with letting diesel cars back in the US. Comparing apples to apples, take a passat offered in gas and diesel. Even with high diesel prices its $.04 cheaper per mile.

Drinkthekoolaid · Sep 28, 2026

Cavalry said:
Let me know when people stop buying SUVs and full size pickup trucks as commute vehicles and I will believe that.

I am all about giving consumers fuel efficient choices. Lets start with letting diesel cars back in the US. Comparing apples to apples, take a passat offered in gas and diesel. Even with high diesel prices its $.04 cheaper per mile.

100%. Options and choices are great. People usually will make a smart choice and choose what best fits their needs.

SonOfSun · Sep 28, 2026

Cavalry said:
Let me know when people stop buying SUVs and full size pickup trucks as commute vehicles and I will believe that.

I am all about giving consumers fuel efficient choices. Lets start with letting diesel cars back in the US. Comparing apples to apples, take a passat offered in gas and diesel. Even with high diesel prices its $.04 cheaper per mile.

I'm not saying choices are bad. I'm saying that prices influence people's behavior and choices. It doesn't matter if Trump rolls back gas milage requirements, if gas prices stay high, there will be consumer demand for more efficient vehicles. The companies that meet consumer demand will "win".

When gas prices go up, people buy more fuel efficient vehicles as an aggregate measurement. This is what the data shows, it's not a personal bias or guess. Yes, John Doe might still buy a big dually. I'm not talking about individual personal choices, I'm referring to overall combined total market sales and trends. When you combine all vehicles sold the extrapolation is that when gas prices go up, more people buy fuel efficient vehicles. This is what hard sales data shows.

The overall correlation here is about +0.48, which is a moderate positive relationship. The clearest examples are 2008→2009, 2011→2012, and 2022→2023, where substantial gas-price increases were followed by relatively large MPG increases of actual vehicles sold.

Sources:

https://www.epa.gov/system/files/documents/2026-02/420r26001.pdf

U.S. Regular All Formulations Retail Gasoline Prices (Dollars per Gallon)

https://download.bls.gov/pub/time.series/cu/cu.data.1.AllItems

OwnTheRide · Sep 28, 2026

Drinkthekoolaid said:
Toyota recently updated the engines on their camry and RAV4, the only choice now is a hybrid, it's standard and there is no alternative and they are in the ~50mpg ballpark.

Yeah, it seems everything is hybrid to some degree nowadays. My wife's 2024 V8 Ram qualifies as a "mild hybrid" due to the engine shutoff at stops. Which necessitates a 48V battery pack and belt-driven generator instead of an alternator. I'm scared to find out what it's going to cost to fix/replace parts relating to that when it gets older.

Grimscale · Sep 29, 2026

I'm old enough to remember when diesel was cheaper than gas. Certainly cheaper than the "high test" gas.
I'm still waiting for an explanation as to why gas is ~$4/gallon and diesel is over $6/gallon.

And, until they make an EV I would actually have a use for, there is no reason for me to buy one.

spat · Sep 29, 2026

Grimscale said:
I'm old enough to remember when diesel was cheaper than gas. Certainly cheaper than the "high test" gas.
I'm still waiting for an explanation as to why gas is ~$4/gallon and diesel is over $6/gallon.

And, until they make an EV I would actually have a use for, there is no reason for me to buy one.

That was before they mandated the low sulfur diesel that increased the refining costs.

Which ironically is the opposite of a greenhouse gas.

The sulfur has a cooling effect in the atmosphere.

Saltwater60 · Sep 29, 2026

livingston said:
People will fore go fuel efficiency to some extent if they can get a vehicle that will last more than a typical warranty period . Case in point ... Will a car with a turbo last 10 - 15 years with out a major engine repair . The main reason a turbo is in a small car is for more fuel efficiency ...

That’s been done for decades now.

Saltwater60 · Sep 29, 2026

Drinkthekoolaid said:
Toyota recently updated the engines on their camry and RAV4, the only choice now is a hybrid, it's standard and there is no alternative and they are in the ~50mpg ballpark.

They have not been able to produce them fast enough, they are sold before they ever reach a dealers lot.

Honda isn’t far behind. Hybrids are in demand and have been for a while now. EVs are trash and as mentioned above the depreciation is immense. Not so with a hybrid.
My son bought brand new because with the incentives on new vs used his Honda was cheaper new. A used civic retains 70% of its value after 5 years. Ones off lease were $2,000-$4,000 less than new. With $2,000 back and 2.99% interest he bought new.

Saltwater60 · Sep 29, 2026

OwnTheRide said:
Yeah, it seems everything is hybrid to some degree nowadays. My wife's 2024 V8 Ram qualifies as a "mild hybrid" due to the engine shutoff at stops. Which necessitates a 48V battery pack and belt-driven generator instead of an alternator. I'm scared to find out what it's going to cost to fix/replace parts relating to that when it gets older.

Just wait until you find out what you need to do to reprogram the vehicle when you replace the battery. I needed to buy a bidirectional scanner for my wife and son’s battery or it will over charge and damage the vehicle. Dealers wanted $600 for the battery replacement. Scanner was $500 and battery was $259. I already made my money back because I used the scanner for other things as well.

Saltwater60 · Sep 29, 2026

This won’t change much of anything. It will slow the demise of vehicles, but it won’t last. Manufacturers know this and won’t adjust anything based on this.
Ford already said they won’t assure a v-8 Mustang GT and has removed the v-8 as an option on their higher end trucks.
Looks like Chevy will get my money again for their v-8 truck if the new 5.7 L is not problematic.

Robin · Sep 29, 2026

Grimscale said:
I'm old enough to remember when diesel was cheaper than gas. Certainly cheaper than the "high test" gas.
I'm still waiting for an explanation as to why gas is ~$4/gallon and diesel is over $6/gallon.

And, until they make an EV I would actually have a use for, there is no reason for me to buy one.

Yeah, me too, about half the price of gasoline, but then, a pick up truck was roughly half the price of a full size sedan as well.
Robin

SonOfSun · Sep 29, 2026

Grimscale said:
I'm old enough to remember when diesel was cheaper than gas. Certainly cheaper than the "high test" gas.
I'm still waiting for an explanation as to why gas is ~$4/gallon and diesel is over $6/gallon.

And, until they make an EV I would actually have a use for, there is no reason for me to buy one.

The largest factor is that since 1990, booming economies (particularly in China, India, and developing nations) dramatically increased their use of heavy machinery, manufacturing, and commercial shipping. Because diesel powers global commerce, international demand for "distillate fuels" outpaced the growth of consumer gasoline demand.

Also the requirement of newer ultra low sulfer fuel oils has had a meaningful contribution to the cost changes as well.

holdover · Sep 29, 2026

Id rather buy a 2010 jeep , maybe replace the engine , im good for 10 years. Hows that for efficient?? I dont have to drive a new car, I have to get to work . the auto market is tanking because nobody want to buy an 80K car . my choice is to fins an old car and fix it up like new . save tens of thousands .

Grimscale · Sep 30, 2026

holdover said:
Id rather buy a 2010 jeep , maybe replace the engine , im good for 10 years. Hows that for efficient?? I dont have to drive a new car, I have to get to work . the auto market is tanking because nobody want to buy an 80K car . my choice is to fins an old car and fix it up like new . save tens of thousands .

Don't go for the 2010. It had the 3.8L and was still computer controlled.
Either go for a 2012 and newer for the 3.6L (which is, actually, better), or go for a TJ (1997-2005).

If I had a shop to work in I'd take the body of my TJ, put it on a JKU (4-door Jeep wrangler from 2007-2018) chassis with an LS or Hemi, Holley sniper system, and beefier axles.
The TJ, being a 1999, is now considered a "classic car" and is exempt from a lot of New York's inspection requirements.

Saltwater60 · Sep 30, 2026

SonOfSun said:
The largest factor is that since 1990, booming economies (particularly in China, India, and developing nations) dramatically increased their use of heavy machinery, manufacturing, and commercial shipping. Because diesel powers global commerce, international demand for "distillate fuels" outpaced the growth of consumer gasoline demand.

Also the requirement of newer ultra low sulfer fuel oils has had a meaningful contribution to the cost changes as well.

Great point.

Saltwater60 · Sep 30, 2026

holdover said:
Id rather buy a 2010 jeep , maybe replace the engine , im good for 10 years. Hows that for efficient?? I dont have to drive a new car, I have to get to work . the auto market is tanking because nobody want to buy an 80K car . my choice is to fins an old car and fix it up like new . save tens of thousands .

This is accurate. I don’t see many tahoes or suburbans these days. Fords large suv market has tanked.
I also heard the 2027 models are being delayed by most automakers because sales are down.

SonOfSun · Sep 30, 2026

holdover said:
Id rather buy a 2010 jeep , maybe replace the engine , im good for 10 years. Hows that for efficient?? I dont have to drive a new car, I have to get to work . the auto market is tanking because nobody want to buy an 80K car . my choice is to fins an old car and fix it up like new . save tens of thousands .

So economic choices. I mentioned fuel costs driving more efficient vehicles, but really that's just a proxy for looking at costs and being more dollar efficient.

Economic situations drive choices. Nothing wrong with fixing up an older vehicle to keep it going. As you mentioned if you spend some decent money on it you can have a nice vehicle cheaper than new.

Trump Kills Biden’s ‘Ridiculous’ Auto Mileage Standards

20×102mm Vulcan