Ammo background checks to begin mid-September?

[dean3690]

Beware of the holds and wait times surrounding lunch and dinner when the contractor staff who processes these at the other end are on their meal break. Also, busy times in the store and meal breaks for store personnel turn this potential 10 min process into a 30-60 min process from getting them to come and help you, unlock the ammo cage, pull your ammo out, wait in line to fill out the form, wait for the store personnel to finish filling out the form (ammo caliber, brand, lot, quantity) , have other store personnel double check everything and sign off/initial, enter your info into the computer, wait for the result, have another store personnel double check the result and sign off/initial, run your payment and give you receipt. Meal times can also delay your picking up and paying for your ship to store items. The only plus is getting to know the store personnel and other ammo buyers in line and having some nice conversations over shared frustrations. It's always interesting to see the reactions of the FUDDS buying a box of slugs.

 

[2WheelGnnr]

I knew I shoulda got a couple more boxes of slugs before this crap went into affect. so with that I figure I will hunt with Rifle this season instead of shotgun as I have plenty of .243........
I will stock back up when I go to pa this spring to renew my PA Non Resident...................

 

[Grimscale]

When a transaction is denied, which is very infrequent, the FFL has already spent a lot of time trying to sell the item. Is their time worth anything and would you work for nothing? A delay is another story as you just have to wait for a definitive answer. I've personally seen, not someone telling me, people that have tried to see if they could pass the background check knowing full well that they will get denied. In my estimation that is just not good behavior.

With this logic the FFL should be charging fees to show guns to potential buyers. What if someone comes in to browse, but ends up not purchasing anything? Then the FFL "worked for free".
I also can't believe there are a significant number of people who only try to buy a gun to see if they can pass a background check. I agree it is not good behavior to do this, so how do you weed those out from the normal people who are legitimately trying to buy a gun without punishing those who are acting in good faith?
Charging a "restocking fee" for something that never left the premises is not good faith. I consider stores/FFLs who do this to be shady and will not frequent their shops.

Unfortunately this is just another way the tyrants running this shit-hole state have brought us to fight amongst ourselves.

 

[Cattafly]

With this logic the FFL should be charging fees to show guns to potential buyers. What if someone comes in to browse, but ends up not purchasing anything? Then the FFL "worked for free".
I also can't believe there are a significant number of people who only try to buy a gun to see if they can pass a background check. I agree it is not good behavior to do this, so how do you weed those out from the normal people who are legitimately trying to buy a gun without punishing those who are acting in good faith?
Charging a "restocking fee" for something that never left the premises is not good faith. I consider stores/FFLs who do this to be shady and will not frequent their shops.

Unfortunately this is just another way the tyrants running this shit-hole state have brought us to fight amongst ourselves.

That's kind of my point. An FFL spends more time on the computer running background checks than mingling with their customers whether they buy or not thus hurting customer relations. There are customers who come right out and tell you they may have a problem with the NYNICS check but want to run it to find out.
I do agree with you that a restocking fee for something that never left the store is not a good practice, but some may be last resorting to ways to keep themselves in business.
Now, the problem is that customers only see how these laws inconvenience them but have no idea what the added costs are to the FFL to just keep the doors open. Go to the NYNICS website and look under dealers and you might find that some of the rules are not only costly but almost impossible to comply with.
Yes, it is the way the tyrants are trying to get us to fight amongst ourselves and put FFLs out of business as they don't have to face pissed off people daily.

 

[Willyone]

That's kind of my point. An FFL spends more time on the computer running background checks than mingling with their customers whether they buy or not thus hurting customer relations. There are customers who come right out and tell you they may have a problem with the NYNICS check but want to run it to find out.
I do agree with you that a restocking fee for something that never left the store is not a good practice, but some may be last resorting to ways to keep themselves in business.
Now, the problem is that customers only see how these laws inconvenience them but have no idea what the added costs are to the FFL to just keep the doors open. Go to the NYNICS website and look under dealers and you might find that some of the rules are not only costly but almost impossible to comply with.
Yes, it is the way the tyrants are trying to get us to fight amongst ourselves and put FFLs out of business as they don't have to face pissed off people daily.

Maybe the FFL could say... ok I'll run a BG check on you for a fee (above the Fed required charge). If you buy a gun from me I'll put that fee amount towards the gun purchase. If you don't by a gun from me, I keep the fee paid.

 

[Cattafly]

Maybe the FFL could say... ok I'll run a BG check on you for a fee (above the Fed required charge). If you buy a gun from me I'll put that fee amount towards the gun purchase. If you don't by a gun from me, I keep the fee paid.

The state background check is not as easy as the federal check was. The check has all the information for that specific firearm unlike the federal check. When a denied check occurs it doesn't end there. The ATF will follow up and want a copy of the 4473 and ask you what you did with that specific firearm. Is it worth it for the FFL?

The way it is going there will be more and more small to medium sized gun shops closing their doors. They have bills to pay and contrary to what people think there is not a lot of money to be made on a firearms sale. Nobody gives them guns to sell, they have to buy them and wait for someone to buy them before they ever see a return on their investment. I sometimes wonder just what most people think the FFL makes on a firearms sale.

 

[FP1201]

The Fed.
My source has already related instances where the State had a "Proceed" but the Fed said "F*** no" (due to the idiot checking "yes" on 21b).


Except it isn't. They are submitting it to the Feds themselves.

So they're using the electronic Forms? I didn't think they played nice with the State System?
(due to the idiot checking "yes" on 21b).
That's one of the big gotcha's ATF is using: People will erroneously without reading and comprehending the questions, answer a "no" question as "yes" because the Dealer is supposed to read and insure there aren't any disqualifiers before submitting a check...before Biden, they'd tell you to contact the person and have them correct it within 24 hours and they'd let it slide within discretion.
Back to the 4473: All the Electronic 4473's I've filled out (and there's been a LOT of them) printed out a Copy that had to be signed and then filed by the Dealer...must be I'm not understanding what's going on here?

 

[FP1201]

Maybe the FFL could say... ok I'll run a BG check on you for a fee (above the Fed required charge). If you buy a gun from me I'll put that fee amount towards the gun purchase. If you don't by a gun from me, I keep the fee paid.

Running a Check without a Transfer intended (test) is prohibited, additionally the type IS required (Handgun, Long Gun, Other/Frame/receiver)
Dealers are assessed the $9.00 Fee, THEY can charge the Customer what ever they damn well feel like...Even the friendlier Dealers are $35. for a Transfer, some are building the cost into the sale Price, I'd imagine the fuckers down on Lawn Guy-Land are hammering patrons for upwards of a hundred bucks... Since I'm an undocumented criminal now, I don't expect to be doing anymore BGC's on anything.

 

[Cattafly]

"Running a Check without a Transfer intended (test) is prohibited, additionally the type IS required (Handgun, Long Gun, Other/Frame/receiver)"

Under the state system it's not that easy. They require specific make, model and serial number along with type. They also require name, address, phone number, driver's license, expiration date, where you were born (city and state) and an email address.

 

[FP1201]

"Running a Check without a Transfer intended (test) is prohibited, additionally the type IS required (Handgun, Long Gun, Other/Frame/receiver)"

Under the state system it's not that easy. They require specific make, model and serial number along with type. They also require name, address, phone number, driver's license, expiration date, where you were born (city and state) and an email address.

correct

 

[VietnamEraVet]

A good friend of mine who is an FFL back in New Yorkistan has finally had enough, and has thrown in the towel, just as Whorecul & company have been trying to force them to do. Open for decades, now closed up. Selling everything and looking to move out of NY. Looking for a home in either North or South Carolina. They wanted to stay there and be close to their children and grandchildren, and enjoy their final years there. Now forced out, - just like me.

Fuck Whorecul & company! If and when SCOTUS steps up to the plate, it will be too late. Fuck!!!

 

[ManualF150]

A good friend of mine who is an FFL back in New Yorkistan has finally had enough, and has thrown in the towel, just as Whorecul & company have been trying to force them to do. Open for decades, now closed up. Selling everything and looking to move out of NY. Looking for a home in either North or South Carolina. They wanted to stay there and be close to their children and grandchildren, and enjoy their final years there. Now forced out, - just like me.

Fuck Whorecul & company! If and when SCOTUS steps up to the plate, it will be too late. Fuck!!!

Same here, I mentioned it a couple pages ago. Shitty times indeed.

 

[Bigfoot]

The only correct answer IMO is to get out of New York if you can.

If I'm wrong about that let me know what I'm missing, what would be the other answer?

 

[Saltwater60]

A good friend of mine who is an FFL back in New Yorkistan has finally had enough, and has thrown in the towel, just as Whorecul & company have been trying to force them to do. Open for decades, now closed up. Selling everything and looking to move out of NY. Looking for a home in either North or South Carolina. They wanted to stay there and be close to their children and grandchildren, and enjoy their final years there. Now forced out, - just like me.

Fuck Whorecul & company! If and when SCOTUS steps up to the plate, it will be too late. Fuck!!!

Man that sucks and sorry to hear that. I noticed a few places that have just opened up recently and I was like what the heck are they doing. One place just expanded and opened up Niagara gun range. Wollcotts just dumped a bunch of money into their place. The firing pin is rebuilding. I’d have taken the insurance money and left if I was him.

 

[VietnamEraVet]

Man that sucks and sorry to hear that. I noticed a few places that have just opened up recently and I was like what the heck are they doing. One place just expanded and opened up Niagara gun range. Wollcotts just dumped a bunch of money into their place. The firing pin is rebuilding. I’d have taken the insurance money and left if I was him.

You're absolutely right, - it does suck. Big time. They spent a lifetime building their home and properties there in NY, with plans to enjoy their final years there in comfort, and to leave their properties to their family members. And now? Can't afford to keep them empty for family to inherit with no income coming in, so they are all being sold, and they will move away from family. How shitty is that???

The more I see living here and after gotten away from NY and opening my eyes, the angrier I get at all of the years I wasted there in NY. I am grateful to be out, - only wish is that I could convince my children to move before they waste their lives under NY's corrupt regime.

 

[Cattafly]

The only correct answer IMO is to get out of New York if you can.

If I'm wrong about that let me know what I'm missing, what would be the other answer?

Yea, for a short term answer. Look at elections that show red states going purple and some already to blue. Virginia as an example. We, as gun owners, tend to put our faith in the court system that has done little for us. Look at the news, Palestinian sympathizers taking to the streets daily and have already got senile Joe to change his stance on the war over there. Until we do the same, our future looks pretty bleak.

 

[VietnamEraVet]

Yea, for a short term answer. Look at elections that show red states going purple and some already to blue. Virginia as an example. We, as gun owners, tend to put our faith in the court system that has done little for us. Look at the news, Palestinian sympathizers taking to the streets daily and have already got senile Joe to change his stance on the war over there. Until we do the same, our future looks pretty bleak.

I don't think any of us here on NYG disagrees with your basic point. Hell, we are fighting it all we can. In many cases, - and mine included, it simply became too economically untenable to stay there any longer, and thus the move, - to the Carolinas in my case. Obviously, there were other reasons too, but at the heart of it, if you cannot afford to live there any longer, you get out. And as many have found, - the grass is truly much greener outside New Yorkistan in the real America.

 

[Cattafly]

I don't think any of us here on NYG disagrees with your basic point. Hell, we are fighting it all we can. In many cases, - and mine included, it simply became too economically untenable to stay there any longer, and thus the move, - to the Carolinas in my case. Obviously, there were other reasons too, but at the heart of it, if you cannot afford to live there any longer, you get out. And as many have found, - the grass is truly much greener outside New Yorkistan in the real America.

As I was saying, I agree that the grass is greener outside of NY, for now. I'm in a gun shop almost daily and hear a lot of bitching. When asked if they sent a simple email or called their representatives the answer is no 99% of the time. Do you vote? No sense in that is the biggest answer I hear. I hear what you are saying though as my thought was if we didn't beat them in the last election that the odds are we never will. That was a winnable election but far too many gun people threw in the towel before it even happened. This state is not economically feasible for a lot of people and I respect that as a reason to leave but as I said, how long before the grass turns brown in all these other states? Our lifetime, our kids lifetime or our grandkids lifetime? Look at Texas, many from California are fleeing there and bringing their politics with them. How long do they stay red?

 

[VietnamEraVet]

As I was saying, I agree that the grass is greener outside of NY, for now. I'm in a gun shop almost daily and hear a lot of bitching. When asked if they sent a simple email or called their representatives the answer is no 99% of the time. Do you vote? No sense in that is the biggest answer I hear. I hear what you are saying though as my thought was if we didn't beat them in the last election that the odds are we never will. That was a winnable election but far too many gun people threw in the towel before it even happened. This state is not economically feasible for a lot of people and I respect that as a reason to leave but as I said, how long before the grass turns brown in all these other states? Our lifetime, our kids lifetime or our grandkids lifetime? Look at Texas, many from California are fleeing there and bringing their politics with them. How long do they stay red?

To paraphrase the experiences of far too many mariners, "you can only bail water from a doomed ship for so long before it will go underwater." And that's when you have to either abandon ship, or get sucked under with it.

New Yorkistan is similarly doomed economically. You can either stay and bail away until you are so financially weak that you may not be able to survive when you finally do jump. Staying there only takes away your assets that would be better spent elsewhere. NY politics, corruption, anti-business climate, poor economy, and anti 2A policies aside, pissing that money away when your living expenses and taxes can be 80% less elsewhere only makes you that much poorer when you are finally forced to abandon ship (NY) for greener pastures.

Your choice. I miss my lifetime home dearly, and resent those bureaucrats who are destroying it. But New Yorkistan will never be my home again.

 

[Cattafly]

"I miss my lifetime home dearly, and resent those bureaucrats who are destroying it. But New Yorkistan will never be my home again."

I hear ya. I guess I may be an old fool who doesn't know when to throw in the towel. If it's at all possible for me to stay near the things that I love, I will. Thank you for your service as you and I seem to be of the same generation and Vietnam vets hold a special place in my heart especially those who didn't come home and those still missing.

 

[FP1201]

The Fed.
My source has already related instances where the State had a "Proceed" but the Fed said "F*** no" (due to the idiot checking "yes" on 21b).


Except it isn't. They are submitting it to the Feds themselves.

Who is the "They"?

 

[MothMan]

Who is the "They"?

the Bros of

 

[FP1201]

With this logic the FFL should be charging fees to show guns to potential buyers. What if someone comes in to browse, but ends up not purchasing anything? Then the FFL "worked for free".
I also can't believe there are a significant number of people who only try to buy a gun to see if they can pass a background check. I agree it is not good behavior to do this, so how do you weed those out from the normal people who are legitimately trying to buy a gun without punishing those who are acting in good faith?
Charging a "restocking fee" for something that never left the premises is not good faith. I consider stores/FFLs who do this to be shady and will not frequent their shops.

Unfortunately this is just another way the tyrants running this shit-hole state have brought us to fight amongst ourselves.

Worked didn't it?

What I witnessed in a large Alabama Gun Shop was a $10. Fee paid UP FRONT to process a NICS Check; If it went through, the fee was applied to the purchase, in the case of a no-go, the FFL was compensated for their time...this goes back at least ten years and last time I was there, they were still charging it...saves from a lot of bullshit from people seeing if they can squeak by.

The September Syracuse Gun Show (days after it went into effect) I figured it into the sale price of the gun: both were "delayed" with one coming back on Sunday, and the other wasn't for a week later; the second sale fell through, and I ate the cost. Honestly, IDGAF if I ever do another Gun Show in NY and as for the Guns I have in inventory, well they can go to Auction and I'll collect a check at the end...for decades I've heard pissing & moaning about "the same stuff" prices, how it can be bought cheaper on-line, the Beanie-Babies and Beef Jerky, bla-bla-bla, and all the bullshit from NYS/ATF/NYSP/Venues, and the mother fuckers that yap about what the NRA hasn't done for New Yorkers, and self-centered as it sounds I don't give a fat-flying-fuck; I've got my guns, ammunition, reloading components, and spare parts, so the ones that haven't prepared, haven't been involved, apathetic to everything, well they can die on the shit covered bed they made.

 

[FP1201]

Man that sucks and sorry to hear that. I noticed a few places that have just opened up recently and I was like what the heck are they doing. One place just expanded and opened up Niagara gun range. Wollcotts just dumped a bunch of money into their place. The firing pin is rebuilding. I’d have taken the insurance money and left if I was him.

The Avalia Family, that founded AR15.com opened a Beautyful, state of the art, fully stocked and equipped Gun Shop in Victor then Cuomo and his henchmen in the Legislature passed un_SAFE and that was the end of that...pics & posts from our last hurrah.

The Art of Pitching a Tent (Demonstrated by Arfcommers) > General Discussion > AR15.COM

Firearm Discussion and Resources from AR-15, AK-47, Handguns and more! Buy, Sell, and Trade your Firearms and Gear.

www.ar15.com

 

[That_FNG]

 

[Parzival]

What's a background check? The last two guns I bought, I didn't even show ID.

 

[Grimscale]

Who is the "They"?

The people who work at Walmart who sell the guns.

 

[Saltwater60]

I don't think any of us here on NYG disagrees with your basic point. Hell, we are fighting it all we can. In many cases, - and mine included, it simply became too economically untenable to stay there any longer, and thus the move, - to the Carolinas in my case. Obviously, there were other reasons too, but at the heart of it, if you cannot afford to live there any longer, you get out. And as many have found, - the grass is truly much greener outside New Yorkistan in the real America.

There’s no fight to win in NYS. We might get a little victory here and there but it will not make a difference in the long term. NYS would have to do a total 180 in all branches of the government to make a difference. I vote and I truly don’t know why. Even in my local city and county elections this year not a single person I voted for was elected. That means not a single republican representative was elected.

 

[DirtyDeeds]

At the last election - 2022 - Sullivan County ushered in Dominion Voting Systems - - - it's like a punch in the gut actually seeing them - yep - pointless comes to mind.

 

[2WheelGnnr]

OK has anyone experienced this....My daughter went to buy ammo at walmart and passed no problem ( as I would have expected) that was sunday but today she goes to runnings to buy some more and gets delayed...now can a person pass no problem one day then get a delay less than a week later??? How can different result happen with the same supposed system everbody is using or should be using. Im confused.... she say she may go to walmart again and just see what happens..... I dont get how that can happen!!!!!

IM stumped.