One Of The Best Explanations Of The Problem With Politics
- Thread starter Dr. Evil
- Start date
libertysnake
.338 Win Mag
I don't disagree, and I think this is not far from the truth. But right now the most powerful republican in our government is wielding federal taxpayer dollars like he is some god-king. And while we have some disagreements on policy as a forum, and I don't disagree with everything Trump does, we should all agree the executive branch should not have this much unchecked power.
So it rings slightly hollow given the times for me.
TEOTWAWKI inc.
.338 Win Mag
Trump has "unchecked power"? Because of EO's? I don't like EO's at all, but they are really just a memo from the boss.
God-king? Lol
Dr. Evil
20×102mm Vulcan
Well, all I can say is he's in "Break glass in case of emergency" mode due to the trainwreck of the last administration. Most knew going in what he campaigned on. He is doing what he said he was going to do. More so than not agree with the changes regardless of how they are being made but of course there has to be a course eventually where the next administration if they differ can't just erase everything he will be doing. I'm still way happier than with the alternative that could be happening now.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
Except Trump isn't wielding dollars. He is welding *cuts*. Basically "un-dollars".
I am OK with the executive having unrestricted power to *not* spend money.
The alternative is for it to be an requirement to spend every dollar that congress allocates.
Imagine sending your son to the store for some groceries, and he finds that they are on sale, and you berate him for not spending all the money you sent him with.
That's what the democrats are arguing.
God-king? Hyperventilate much?
libertysnake
.338 Win Mag
That's not accurate. He is definitely using federal funding as a weapon.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
Again, that's threatening to *cut off* money.
Money that probably shouldn't be spent at all. The federal government shouldn't be subsidizing any state crap.
So, again, what's the problem ? I'd like to see *all* of that money cut off to *everyone*.
So, it's like the government shutdowns. Basically "don't threaten me with a good time".
Robin
.577 Tyrannosaur.
Claptrap.
Robin
libertysnake
.338 Win Mag
The problem is if you take the money, and then threaten to cut off the money you took, what does that make you?
If someone comes to you and says "give me your money or else" and then uses your inability to fill your gas tank against you, would you not call that coercion?
I don't understand what is difficult to explain. My stance on this has been consistent on this forum for YEARS. The feds control states by over taxing and "giving" back money they overtook. It needs to stop.
Every admin in the past 40 years has used that threat
Follow the federal drinking age....or lose funding
Follow our federal approved speed limit mandates or.... Lose funding
Follow our diversity policies..... Or lose funding
There are probably 100 examples of this occurring. The only difference is the media is in doom loop mode trying so hard to gin up outrage.
Follow the federal drinking age....or lose funding
Follow our federal approved speed limit mandates or.... Lose funding
Follow our diversity policies..... Or lose funding
There are probably 100 examples of this occurring. The only difference is the media is in doom loop mode trying so hard to gin up outrage.
I'm listening to the argument that states, are "States" and should be treated as such.
We are The United States of America.
In theory each state should be it's own mini country
libertysnake
.338 Win Mag
It's time states started exercising their rights. Say "no" to the money. None of this "mandate" bullshit where policy totally changes due to "funding" every four fucking years.
Same for localities. If no new "law" has been passed it's just a matter of funding. Localities should say "no, we don't want to do this. Fuck off with your money" and just not abide if it's lawful but just defunded.
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spat
.700 Nitro Express
You're not wrong. But Trump isn't the one who set up the "taking". And he *is* setting up an environment where even the democrats are starting to see that arrangement isn't a good one.
Go over on Democratic Underground and see how many of the lefties are now calling for CA to withhold their tax dollars from the feds.
They're hopelessly naive in their approach, but at least they're finally seeing that it's not a good idea to funnel all taxes through the federal government and back to the states.
I have said for a long time that the left will never abandon their crooked ways until they get burned by them themselves. Well, it's BBQ time bitches.
libertysnake
.338 Win Mag
This forum in 2020-2024: "Using fed funding as a weapon isn't fair!"
This forum in 2025: "Yeah but Trump didn't start it."
It's either wrong or it isn't. You can't be fair weather patriots. Stand by your convictions.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
It's wrong. But you need to fight fire with fire.
Just like I support the bombing of Dresden, Hiroshima, and Nagasaki in WWII. All three were atrocities of the first order. But once you are in a war with existential stakes you need to decide if you would rather be morally pure, or victorious.
And I'll give you a hint, your moral purity isn't worth much from the inside of a reedication camp
libertysnake
.338 Win Mag
Horse shit. People on this forum have been bitching about how without religion you have no morality.
No, when you give up your ethics, your creed, you give up who you are. You give up who you are, and for what price? To let war shape you into a totally different person? Then you've lost the war.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
Maybe others, but not me.
I refuse to fall into the "be the better person" trap.
I believe in strong libertarian principles, because that's the world I want to live in. But I have no illusions that you won't have to do some pretty heinous shit to get there from here.
Imagine what WWII would have looked like if the allies had refused to compromise their goody two shoes image.
You don't need to be perfect, just better than the other guys. Sometimes that means better at welding brutality than they are.
We didn't invent this form of economic warfare, but we're sure as shit going to beat the hell out of them with it until they sue for peace.
libertysnake
.338 Win Mag
The road to hell is paved with good intentions. If you sacrifice your principles in the process, then you become the tyrant. You become no better than what you hate, because you walked the same path as one.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
You know who writes history and decides what is right ?
The people who are left.
You're not wrong about the road to hell. But if you aren't willing to fight dirty out of some misguided sense of superiority, then you're going to end up there anyway.
Rules are for sports, not fighting.
libertysnake
.338 Win Mag
Suit yourself.
I'd rather live and die by my terms. No one will take that from me. No one will mold me into someone I'm not. Neither person nor circumstance.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
I am the same.
I think that maybe my principles are just a but more sophisticated than yours.
It's like the difference between a real libertarian and an anarchist. A real libertarian understands that *some* rules are necessary to maximize freedom, and *some* group needs the power to enforce those rules.
Or, it's like cleaning out your garage. Imaging a "no compromise" version of that where you refuse to move anything unless the garage is cleaner after the move than before.
"No, can't pull that box out of there to clean behind it, the spot your going to sit it in is worse than where it is now".
I think that's admirable to hold to your moral compass regardless in good times and bad.
I want to think I live my life this way but the reality is it's a little more nuanced.
I'm pragmatic and am willing to make compromises when I evaluate circumstances. Some shit is unavoidable and you want to mitigate risk or damage and increase benefit. A little good is better than no good. A little bad is better than all bad.
Just my .02 cents.
There is no moral superiority to abstaining from using a tool that could ultimately help others just because of how it was created or previously used.
All that makes you is an ignorant permanent victim.
But I guess some people are more valuable as a statistic than as a living, fighting leader.
What is morally superior is to use that tool in a way that mitigates the worst of its negative affects on the innocent, while maximizing the effects on the guilty, and brings visibility of that tool to light so that ALL realize how much of a mistake it was to create it.
Then you can get that tool destroyed.
And that is exactly what is happening right now.
Tools created to oppress Americans are being used to "oppress" the villains instead. The end goal (hopefully) will be the destruction of these tools for the good of all.
The absolute most egregious thing for me about politics is the hypocrisy. Once it becomes "rules for thee and not for me" then it's time to clean house.
All that makes you is an ignorant permanent victim.
But I guess some people are more valuable as a statistic than as a living, fighting leader.
What is morally superior is to use that tool in a way that mitigates the worst of its negative affects on the innocent, while maximizing the effects on the guilty, and brings visibility of that tool to light so that ALL realize how much of a mistake it was to create it.
Then you can get that tool destroyed.
And that is exactly what is happening right now.
Tools created to oppress Americans are being used to "oppress" the villains instead. The end goal (hopefully) will be the destruction of these tools for the good of all.
The absolute most egregious thing for me about politics is the hypocrisy. Once it becomes "rules for thee and not for me" then it's time to clean house.
Blimey
.450/400 Nitro Ex
These tools you ostensibly deride are being honed and sharpened by a person who calls himself a king and who, by his admission and that of the supreme court, is above the law.
Your last two sentences are surely endorsed by everybody, but the fact you wrote them after condoning actions that--if taken by somebody like biden using soros as his house-cleaner--would have fomented a great loathing in you seems to me quite oblivious.
So far only one person in this thread has begun to question what is going on. Let me make it easy for you: billionaires care nothing about you. None of them ever have, and they never will. While an immigrant slashes jobs left, right, and center with barely a thought about whether they are important, the president is today on truth social posting memes making fun of the fact. Imagine for a moment having moved to DC last summer for a job with homeland security. Now you're getting shitcanned by a guy who read a report from a 19 year old named "big balls" put together, and when you dare to complain about it the president makes fun of you for it. That's so unnecessarily callous.
I guess we found one person who is tired of all the winning.
The supreme Court ruled he was above the law? Guess I missed that one. Then again I don't read hyperbolic partisan democrat news sources.
spat
.700 Nitro Express
The difference between billionaires and bureaucrats is that the billionaires don't pretend to be doing their shit "for my own good".
I have no illusions that Musk or Trump are altruistic, or that either of them give a fuck about me.
But, on many issues that matter, their interests and mine align, and I can trust them to pursue their own interests when they align with mine.
Elon had very little interest in politics until the FAA started screwing with his favorite hobby. When he could design and build a new groundbreaking rocket faster than he could get approval to launch it, he got pissed.
When they started just plain making stuff up to screw with him (like what are the odds the rocket spashing down in the Indian Ocean is going to hit an endangered shark, telling him that there's always one more permit needed for him to dump potable water into the fucking ocean for instance) he got downright angry.
You can probably thank the FAA bureaucrats which were screwing with him for ultimately delivering the election to Trump.
So, I can absolutely trust him to tear down federal bullshit, not for the "greater good", but because it personally pisses him off.
Since I also have a strong interest in eliminating worthless bureaucracy his interests align with mine.
The left wing mantra that he (or Trump) are just in it for money is ridiculous. Musk makes money fastest when he concentrates on Tesla and SpaceX. This government adventure is costing him *a lot* of money. Trump is similar.
But, once you have billions, you have all the money you need to do what you want. That means you now have other constraints you need go overcome. Making more money isn't useful for you anymore.
If you want to know who the greedy fucks who will sell you out over politics are, look at rhe guys who's net worth rises by millions a year while they're on a $200k salary.
Those are the guys robbing the tax payers blind.
dwa12479
.338 Win Mag
Did your wife's boyfriend approve this post before you sent it?