"Large Capacity" mags protected, 9th circuit

[Grimscale]

I'm sorry to inject a rational question into this you-said-no-you-said bullshit

The fact that the decision is stayed at the moment is pretty much automatic; if you lose an appeal and you have a higher court to appeal to, you almost always immediately file leave to appeal to that court, which means the lower court (here the 3 judge 9th cir. panel) has to stay the decision.

I did not think a stay was automatic if a Law is overturned. I thought the defending .gov goon had to request a stay, and justify the continued infringement, for a judge to put one into effect.

In this case, however, the stay was already imposed by the lower court, hence being "automatic", and a request to lift the stay would have to be argued.

 

[Robin]

Rough night, they must be sleeping in.
Robin

 

[BDinPutnam]

I'm sorry to inject a rational question into this you-said-no-you-said bullshit



I did not think a stay was automatic if a Law is overturned. I thought the defending .gov goon had to request a stay, and justify the continued infringement, for a judge to put one into effect.

In this case, however, the stay was already imposed by the lower court, hence being "automatic", and a request to lift the stay would have to be argued.

Good points. I'm coming from the position of civil cases involving private parties. I suppose I have to go read the full decisions in both now...

I *think* here it may be in a somewhat weird place procedurally since the AG didn't immediately file notice- so the lower court's preliminary injunction stays in effect but not the permanent. I dunno, now I'm a bit confused on the whole thing again, heh heh.

The fact that the AG didn't immediately file notice informs my opinion that he knows its risky- if he brings it to the full 9th they may rule against him (though unlikely). If he wins en banc that would tee it up for plaintiffs to appeal to SCOTUS.

 

[Grimscale]

The fact that the AG didn't immediately file notice informs my opinion that he knows its risky

it also makes me ask the question "how long must a stay remain in effect if the AG delays his appeal"?
How long are they allowed to drag out further infringement while they "decide"?

 

[BDinPutnam]

it also makes me ask the question "how long must a stay remain in effect if the AG delays his appeal"?
How long are they allowed to drag out further infringement while they "decide"?

Looks like 14 days to shit or get off the pot to me. Though I haven't read this carefully, IANAL, and I have very little experience with CA.

Federal Rules of Appellate Procedure, Ninth Circuit Rules, Circuit Advisory Committee Notes

cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov

 

[Chevusa]

Looks like 14 days to shit or get off the pot to me. Though I haven't read this carefully, IANAL, and I have very little experience with CA.

Federal Rules of Appellate Procedure, Ninth Circuit Rules, Circuit Advisory Committee Notes

cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov

It stands until there is a final conclusion in the case. It has stood since some time in April I believe or right around there. It is the same order of stay from the lower court it was just affirmed by the higher court.

 

[BDinPutnam]

It stands until there is a final conclusion in the case. It has stood since some time in April I believe or right around there. It is the same order of stay from the lower court it was just affirmed by the higher court.

Right so now my opinion kind of swings back- because the current state of play appears to be "status quo per the lower court" one could read that as being legal to ship the mags, at least for the next what, ten days or so?

I dunno, I'm only on my 3rd cup of coffee.

 

[Xae289]

An “old friend” of mine once said, “It don’t take more than 7 boolits to keel s deer”

Guess all we need are single-shots then. Screw it, only smooth-bore, flintlock muzzleloaders. It's gonna be really inconvenient when I strap on 4 flintlock pistols and a couple of wheellocks before I leave in the morning in case I encounter a gang of angry and violent deer that need hunting.

 

[Chevusa]

Right so now my opinion kind of swings back- because the current state of play appears to be "status quo per the lower court" one could read that as being legal to ship the mags, at least for the next what, ten days or so?

I dunno, I'm only on my 3rd cup of coffee.

No the court specifically issued a stay that no mags may be sold, shipped, bought etc etc. I’ve posted it yesterday. There is not an expiration date. The stay is in force until there is a final conclusion of the case whether that is circuit or scotus.

 

[BDinPutnam]

Oh what a torturous procedural history. I get it now.

So the week BEFORE Judge Benitez issued the stay of the lower court's decision (his own decision) was the week people went apeshit ordering mags (@Grimscale that's in keeping with your comments about overturning a law- it was overturned and suspended and the AG went back the next week and asked for a stay of the injunction).

Benetiz issued the stay in April, pending resolution at the 9th circuit.

The 9th last week decided this law is dead on arrival but continued the stay pending the AG dropping it, petitioning for en banc, or cert to SCOTUS. That would be the 14 days I'm talking about above.

What a fucking cat circus.

If I had to guess, the AG drops it and the gun grabbers try a different tactic. That makes the 9th / 2nd circuit split moot as far as SCOTUS is concerned because there's no live controversy to bring to them to resolve.

 

[Edwardteach72]

Oh what a torturous procedural history. I get it now.

So the week BEFORE Judge Benitez issued the stay of the lower court's decision (his own decision) was the week people went apeshit ordering mags (@Grimscale that's in keeping with your comments about overturning a law- it was overturned and suspended and the AG went back the next week and asked for a stay of the injunction).

Benetiz issued the stay in April, pending resolution at the 9th circuit.

The 9th last week decided this law is dead on arrival but continued the stay pending the AG dropping it, petitioning for en banc, or cert to SCOTUS. That would be the 14 days I'm talking about above.

What a fucking cat circus.

If I had to guess, the AG drops it and the gun grabbers try a different tactic. That makes the 9th / 2nd circuit split moot as far as SCOTUS is concerned because there's no live controversy to bring to them to resolve.

I honestly bet the AG will take this En Banc and win. Meaning Duncan will have to then appeal and petition to SCOTUS who will refuse to hear it

 

[BDinPutnam]

I honestly bet the AG will take this En Banc and win. Meaning Duncan will have to then appeal and petition to SCOTUS who will refuse to hear it

I wouldn't bet against this, either. Either way I think this goes nowhere good for NY, and may even go poorly for CA as well.

And actually I just thought- SCOTUS would have a leg to stand on in denying Duncan cert because at that point there wouldn't be a circuit split.

 

[Edwardteach72]

I wouldn't bet against this, either. Either way I think this goes nowhere good for NY, and may even go poorly for CA as well.

Oh this will have zero... zero.. efect on NY

At best people can say "it causes a split in the lower court's, SCOTUS HAS to step in"

Well that would mean the 9th says they are protected and 5 of 6 other courts (one being the 2nd aka ours) says they are not protected and the rest i don't believe have taken up any magazine ban cases... so the split would be 5/6 - 1. Yea SCOTUS wouldn't jump in

 

[BDinPutnam]

Oh this will have zero... zero.. efect on NY

At best people can say "it causes a split in the lower court's, SCOTUS HAS to step in"

Well that would mean the 9th says they are protected and 5 of 6 other courts (one being the 2nd aka ours) says they are not protected and the rest i don't believe have taken up any magazine ban cases... so the split would be 5/6 - 1. Yea SCOTUS wouldn't jump in

Well yeah because if the AG wins en banc the plaintiffs would petition for cert and in the briefing the AG would very much point out that magazine limits have been upheld in other courts i.e. the 2nd circuit.

 

[Edwardteach72]

Well yeah because if the AG wins en banc the plaintiffs would petition for cert and in the briefing the AG would very much point out that magazine limits have been upheld in other courts i.e. the 2nd circuit.

Yupp and list the other 4 or 5 courts that have also upheld.

But but if they lose the AG will pull a Washington DC and most likely just let their L stand not wanting to risk a low but potential loss at SCOTUS meaning all those other lower court rulings may be tossed out as well making any and all mag bans unconstitutional (similar to why Washington DC never petitioned SCOTUS when they lost their case for concealed carry)

 

[GOPerfect]

I'm good. I have plenty of the mags that I need and want. Stacks and stacks of them.... Good to go with or without this ruling.

Speaking of this ruling, depending on what happens in November, it could turn out to be a real nothing burger.

 

[Robin]

So if AG goes En band and wins, what is to stop the legislature from revising the law to one round magazines. Nothing.
Robin
Somehow 'wins' isn't the characterization for a scammed up dog and pony show.

 

[Blackpowdershooter30]

This has been done twice now and even though we are allowed knunchucks and tasers now in this state they still aren't for sale. Hopefully this comes out way and this states government is in for a rude awakening.

 

[Chevusa]

 

[Acer-m14]

so do not sell , buy or trade HC mags .. ok come on gun shops/manufactures .. 100K HC mags free give a way LOL .

 

[Chevusa]

Update.

 

[Mosinitis]

Update.

Uncertainty factor makes prosecution unlikely.

 

[Chevusa]

Uncertainty factor makes prosecution unlikely.

Did you watch the video?

People have been charged.

Stings are being setup.

 

[Defilade]

Talk about wasted taxpayer money!

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

Ok Ok I'll admit it. I recently bought "large capacity" magazines from a company that ships.

 

[Mosinitis]

Did you watch the video?

People have been charged.

Stings are being setup.

How would he know about stings being set up? He gave one example of someone getting in trouble, but in most of such cases something else is involved. All in all he sounds like a BS artist.