Congress Agrees to 2.3 TRILLION Spending Package,

GOPerfect

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Blimey said:
Probably true. I’m just reeling at the idea that everyone will get this. It’s beyond reason.

Many people’s incomes are up since last year. Is this to stimulate the economy which in theory we could do by having “free”’money every month or is it to help people out? I dare so most receiving this money don’t need it at all. Deficits have to matter. So this is another $200B plus I’m guessing?
Click to expand...


100% agree. I do need this at all. I am well over 100k for the year, I absolutely do not need this 2 grand. 2020, I made/earned more money than all others in the past.

My investments are through the roof. We, Americans, cannot afford this. But, whatever, they gonna give me and the wife 2 grand each? I will take it, I will buy her a new car. Four thousand more for the down payment.
 
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At this point its all over but the crying. We have reached a point of no return. The United States cannot possibly survive on a credit card economy.

The bond market is tanking bad , forceing investors into the stock market . Stocks are oversold compared to their profits. Were counterfeiting money like Zimbabwe, Venesuala, and post ww1 Germany. I bought a pizza tonight delivered 26bucks plus tip. next year at this time, thats going to seem cheap. It may be 35 or more. This economy is going to crash like nothing the world has ever seen before, its going to make 1929 look like a birthday party. And like Bracken said when the music stops ( welfare, etb cards stop. ) there are going to be food riots. Were fucked.
 
Jmac00

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holdover said:
At this point its all over but the crying. We have reached a point of no return. The United States cannot possibly survive on a credit card economy.

The bond market is tanking bad , forceing investors into the stock market . Stocks are oversold compared to their profits. Were counterfeiting money like Zimbabwe, Venesuala, and post ww1 Germany. I bought a pizza tonight delivered 26bucks plus tip. next year at this time, thats going to seem cheap. It may be 35 or more. This economy is going to crash like nothing the world has ever seen before, its going to make 1929 look like a birthday party. And like Bracken said when the music stops ( welfare, etb cards stop. ) there are going to be food riots. Were fucked.
Click to expand...

and even if the crash come in 2022, it will still be Trumps fault :rock: :ROFL:
 
GOPerfect

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holdover said:
At this point its all over but the crying. We have reached a point of no return. The United States cannot possibly survive on a credit card economy.

The bond market is tanking bad , forceing investors into the stock market . Stocks are oversold compared to their profits. Were counterfeiting money like Zimbabwe, Venesuala, and post ww1 Germany. I bought a pizza tonight delivered 26bucks plus tip. next year at this time, thats going to seem cheap. It may be 35 or more. This economy is going to crash like nothing the world has ever seen before, its going to make 1929 look like a birthday party. And like Bracken said when the music stops ( welfare, etb cards stop. ) there are going to be food riots. Were fucked.
Click to expand...


Gotta be more like me... Don't tip!
 
SonOfSun

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Jmac00 said:
LMFAO, your delusional if you think the loony left won't blame Trump, your statement is down right laughable
Click to expand...

Both sides will blame each other, it's how it goes. The truth is that we've been on this fiscal course for a while now. The last 4 years and the next 4 years are largely irrelevant to where we are headed.
 
SonOfSun

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Jmac00 said:
I guess the last 4 years taught you nothing.

View attachment 101503
Click to expand...


I didn't drop anything, you just reached into your pocket. We've been on this debt ride for quite a while. Stop being intentionally obtuse.

The numbers....


In his FY 2021 budget, Trump's budget includes a $1.566 trillion deficit, representing a projected 5.8% increase over 2020.10
  • FY 2020 - $4.226 trillion (The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) predicted that the pandemic would raise the FY 2020 deficit by $2.2 trillion and the FY 2021 deficit by $0.6 trillion)
  • FY 2019 - $1.563 trillion
  • FY 2018 - $1.272 trillion
Barack Obama: Added $8.588 trillion, a 73.6% increase from the $11.657 trillion debt at the end of Bush’s last budget in 2009.
George W. Bush: Added $5.849 trillion, a 101% increase from the $5.8 trillion debt at the end of Clinton's last budget, FY 2001.
  • FY 2009 - $1.632 trillion. This was Bush's deficit without the impact of the Economic Stimulus Act.
  • FY 2008 - $1.017 trillion
  • FY 2007 - $501 billion
  • FY 2006 - $574 billion
  • FY 2005 - $553 billion
  • FY 2004 - $596 billion
  • FY 2003 - $555 billion
  • FY 2002 - $421 billion
Bill Clinton: Added $1.396 trillion, a 31.6% increase from the $4.4 trillion debt at the end of George H.W. Bush's last budget.
  • FY 2001 - $133 billion
  • FY 2000 - $18 billion
  • FY 1999 - $130 billion
  • FY 1998 - $113 billion
  • FY 1997 - $189 billion
  • FY 1996 - $251 billion
  • FY 1995 - $281 billion
  • FY 1994 - $281 billion
George H.W. Bush: Added $1.554 trillion, a 54% increase from the $2.857 trillion debt at the end of Reagan's last budge.
  • FY 1993 - $347 billion
  • FY 1992 - $399 billion
  • FY 1991 - $432 billion
  • FY 1990 - $376 billion
Ronald Reagan: Added $1.86 trillion, a 186% increase from the $997.8 billion debt at the end of Carter's last budget.
  • FY 1989 - $255 billion
  • FY 1988 - $252 billion
  • FY 1987 - $225 billion
  • FY 1986 - $302 billion
  • FY 1985 - $251 billion
  • FY 1984 - $195 billion
  • FY 1983 - $235 billion
  • FY 1982 - $145 billion
Jimmy Carter: Added $299 billion, a 42.7% increase from the $698.8 billion debt at the end of Ford's last budget.
  • FY 1981 - $90.1 billion
  • FY 1980 - $81.1 billion
  • FY 1979 - $54.9 billion
  • FY 1978 - $72.7 billion
Gerald Ford: Added $223.7 billion, a 47.1% increase from the $475 billion debt at the end of Nixon's last budget.
  • FY 1977 - $78.4 billion
  • FY 1976 - $87.2 billion
  • FY 1975 - $58.1 billion
Richard Nixon: Added $121.3 billion, a 34.3% increase from the $353.7 billion debt at the end of President Johnson's last budget.
  • FY 1974 - $16.9 billion
  • FY 1973 - $30.8 billion
  • FY 1972 - $29.1 billion
  • FY 1971 - $27.2 billion
  • FY 1970 - $17.1 billion
Lyndon B. Johnson: Added $42 billion, a 13% increase from the $312 billion debt at the end of President Kennedy's last budget, FY 1964.
  • FY 1969 - $6.1 billion
  • FY 1968 - $21.3 billion
  • FY 1967 - $6.3 billion
  • FY 1966 - $2.6 billion
  • FY 1965 - $5.5 billion
John F. Kennedy: Added $23 billion, an 7.8% increase from the $288.9 billion debt at the end of Eisenhower's last budget.
  • FY 1964 - $5.8 billion
  • FY 1963 - $7.6 billion
  • FY 1962 - $9.2 billion
Dwight Eisenhower: Added $22.8 billion, a 8.6% increase from the $266 billion debt at the end of Truman's last budget.
  • FY 1961 - $2.6 billion
  • FY 1960 - $1.6 billion
  • FY 1959 - $8.3 billion
  • FY 1958 - $5.8 billion
  • FY 1957 - $2.2 billion surplus
  • FY 1956 - $1.6 billion surplus
  • FY 1955 - $3.1 billion
  • FY 1954 - $5.1 billion
Harry Truman: Added $7.3 billion, a 2.8% increase from the $258.6 billion debt at the end of President Roosevelt’s last budget.
  • FY 1953 - $6.9 billion
  • FY 1952 - $3.8 billion
  • FY 1951 - $2.1 billion surplus
  • FY 1950 - $4.5 billion
  • FY 1949 - $478 million surplus
  • FY 1948 - $6 billion surplus
  • FY 1947 - $11 billion surplus
  • FY 1946 - $10.7 billion
Franklin D. Roosevelt: Added $236 billion, a 1,048% increase from the $22.5 billion debt at the end of Hoover's last budget.
  • FY 1945 - $57.6 billion
  • FY 1944 - $64.3 billion
  • FY 1943 - $64.2 billion
  • FY 1942 - $23.4 billion
  • FY 1941 - $6 billion
  • FY 1940 - $2.5 billion
  • FY 1939 - $3.2 billion
  • FY 1938 - $740 million
  • FY 1937 - $2.6 billion
  • FY 1936 - $5 billion
  • FY 1935 - $1.6 billion
  • FY 1934 - $4.5 billion
 
Jmac00

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SonOfSun said:
I didn't drop anything, you just reached into your pocket. We've been on this debt ride for quite a while. Stop being intentionally obtuse.

The numbers....


In his FY 2021 budget, Trump's budget includes a $1.566 trillion deficit, representing a projected 5.8% increase over 2020.10
Barack Obama: Added $8.588 trillion, a 73.6% increase from the $11.657 trillion debt at the end of Bush’s last budget in 2009.
George W. Bush: Added $5.849 trillion, a 101% increase from the $5.8 trillion debt at the end of Clinton's last budget, FY 2001.
  • FY 2009 - $1.632 trillion. This was Bush's deficit without the impact of the Economic Stimulus Act.
  • FY 2008 - $1.017 trillion
  • FY 2007 - $501 billion
  • FY 2006 - $574 billion
  • FY 2005 - $553 billion
  • FY 2004 - $596 billion
  • FY 2003 - $555 billion
  • FY 2002 - $421 billion
Bill Clinton: Added $1.396 trillion, a 31.6% increase from the $4.4 trillion debt at the end of George H.W. Bush's last budget.
  • FY 2001 - $133 billion
  • FY 2000 - $18 billion
  • FY 1999 - $130 billion
  • FY 1998 - $113 billion
  • FY 1997 - $189 billion
  • FY 1996 - $251 billion
  • FY 1995 - $281 billion
  • FY 1994 - $281 billion
George H.W. Bush: Added $1.554 trillion, a 54% increase from the $2.857 trillion debt at the end of Reagan's last budge.
  • FY 1993 - $347 billion
  • FY 1992 - $399 billion
  • FY 1991 - $432 billion
  • FY 1990 - $376 billion
Ronald Reagan: Added $1.86 trillion, a 186% increase from the $997.8 billion debt at the end of Carter's last budget.
  • FY 1989 - $255 billion
  • FY 1988 - $252 billion
  • FY 1987 - $225 billion
  • FY 1986 - $302 billion
  • FY 1985 - $251 billion
  • FY 1984 - $195 billion
  • FY 1983 - $235 billion
  • FY 1982 - $145 billion
Jimmy Carter: Added $299 billion, a 42.7% increase from the $698.8 billion debt at the end of Ford's last budget.
  • FY 1981 - $90.1 billion
  • FY 1980 - $81.1 billion
  • FY 1979 - $54.9 billion
  • FY 1978 - $72.7 billion
Gerald Ford: Added $223.7 billion, a 47.1% increase from the $475 billion debt at the end of Nixon's last budget.
  • FY 1977 - $78.4 billion
  • FY 1976 - $87.2 billion
  • FY 1975 - $58.1 billion
Richard Nixon: Added $121.3 billion, a 34.3% increase from the $353.7 billion debt at the end of President Johnson's last budget.
  • FY 1974 - $16.9 billion
  • FY 1973 - $30.8 billion
  • FY 1972 - $29.1 billion
  • FY 1971 - $27.2 billion
  • FY 1970 - $17.1 billion
Lyndon B. Johnson: Added $42 billion, a 13% increase from the $312 billion debt at the end of President Kennedy's last budget, FY 1964.
  • FY 1969 - $6.1 billion
  • FY 1968 - $21.3 billion
  • FY 1967 - $6.3 billion
  • FY 1966 - $2.6 billion
  • FY 1965 - $5.5 billion
John F. Kennedy: Added $23 billion, an 7.8% increase from the $288.9 billion debt at the end of Eisenhower's last budget.
  • FY 1964 - $5.8 billion
  • FY 1963 - $7.6 billion
  • FY 1962 - $9.2 billion
Dwight Eisenhower: Added $22.8 billion, a 8.6% increase from the $266 billion debt at the end of Truman's last budget.
  • FY 1961 - $2.6 billion
  • FY 1960 - $1.6 billion
  • FY 1959 - $8.3 billion
  • FY 1958 - $5.8 billion
  • FY 1957 - $2.2 billion surplus
  • FY 1956 - $1.6 billion surplus
  • FY 1955 - $3.1 billion
  • FY 1954 - $5.1 billion
Harry Truman: Added $7.3 billion, a 2.8% increase from the $258.6 billion debt at the end of President Roosevelt’s last budget.
  • FY 1953 - $6.9 billion
  • FY 1952 - $3.8 billion
  • FY 1951 - $2.1 billion surplus
  • FY 1950 - $4.5 billion
  • FY 1949 - $478 million surplus
  • FY 1948 - $6 billion surplus
  • FY 1947 - $11 billion surplus
  • FY 1946 - $10.7 billion
Franklin D. Roosevelt: Added $236 billion, a 1,048% increase from the $22.5 billion debt at the end of Hoover's last budget.
  • FY 1945 - $57.6 billion
  • FY 1944 - $64.3 billion
  • FY 1943 - $64.2 billion
  • FY 1942 - $23.4 billion
  • FY 1941 - $6 billion
  • FY 1940 - $2.5 billion
  • FY 1939 - $3.2 billion
  • FY 1938 - $740 million
  • FY 1937 - $2.6 billion
  • FY 1936 - $5 billion
  • FY 1935 - $1.6 billion
  • FY 1934 - $4.5 billion
Click to expand...

I think we have reached a new level of Butt hurt BWHAHAHAHA I think someone needs a chill pill. You really shouldn't get so upset everytime someone bashes Joe Bidophile
 
SonOfSun

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Jmac00 said:
I think we have reached a new level of Butt hurt BWHAHAHAHA I think someone needs a chill pill. You really shouldn't get so upset everytime someone bashes Joe Bidophile
Click to expand...
I'm not butthurt at all, I'm just trying to explain basic math in a way you can understand. When was Biden even a major part of this? The fiscal course this country has been on goes back decades. Trump didn't get us here. Biden isn't going to change it. At this point it's all deficit momentum, our budgets are trillions of dollars short, you don't just plug that hole with a few cuts.
 
Jmac00

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SonOfSun said:
I'm not butthurt at all, I'm just trying to explain basic math in a way you can understand. When was Biden even a major part of this? The fiscal course this country has been on goes back decades. Trump didn't get us here. Biden isn't going to change it. At this point it's all deficit momentum, our budgets are trillions of dollars short, you don't just plug that hole with a few cuts.
Click to expand...

Im sorry dude, I can't take this shit seriously any more, LOL Im out
 
spat

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SonOfSun said:
I didn't drop anything, you just reached into your pocket. We've been on this debt ride for quite a while. Stop being intentionally obtuse.

The numbers....


In his FY 2021 budget, Trump's budget includes a $1.566 trillion deficit, representing a projected 5.8% increase over 2020.10
  • FY 2020 - $4.226 trillion (The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) predicted that the pandemic would raise the FY 2020 deficit by $2.2 trillion and the FY 2021 deficit by $0.6 trillion)
  • FY 2019 - $1.563 trillion
  • FY 2018 - $1.272 trillion
Barack Obama: Added $8.588 trillion, a 73.6% increase from the $11.657 trillion debt at the end of Bush’s last budget in 2009.
George W. Bush: Added $5.849 trillion, a 101% increase from the $5.8 trillion debt at the end of Clinton's last budget, FY 2001.
  • FY 2009 - $1.632 trillion. This was Bush's deficit without the impact of the Economic Stimulus Act.
  • FY 2008 - $1.017 trillion
  • FY 2007 - $501 billion
  • FY 2006 - $574 billion
  • FY 2005 - $553 billion
  • FY 2004 - $596 billion
  • FY 2003 - $555 billion
  • FY 2002 - $421 billion
Bill Clinton: Added $1.396 trillion, a 31.6% increase from the $4.4 trillion debt at the end of George H.W. Bush's last budget.
  • FY 2001 - $133 billion
  • FY 2000 - $18 billion
  • FY 1999 - $130 billion
  • FY 1998 - $113 billion
  • FY 1997 - $189 billion
  • FY 1996 - $251 billion
  • FY 1995 - $281 billion
  • FY 1994 - $281 billion
George H.W. Bush: Added $1.554 trillion, a 54% increase from the $2.857 trillion debt at the end of Reagan's last budge.
  • FY 1993 - $347 billion
  • FY 1992 - $399 billion
  • FY 1991 - $432 billion
  • FY 1990 - $376 billion
Ronald Reagan: Added $1.86 trillion, a 186% increase from the $997.8 billion debt at the end of Carter's last budget.
  • FY 1989 - $255 billion
  • FY 1988 - $252 billion
  • FY 1987 - $225 billion
  • FY 1986 - $302 billion
  • FY 1985 - $251 billion
  • FY 1984 - $195 billion
  • FY 1983 - $235 billion
  • FY 1982 - $145 billion
Jimmy Carter: Added $299 billion, a 42.7% increase from the $698.8 billion debt at the end of Ford's last budget.
  • FY 1981 - $90.1 billion
  • FY 1980 - $81.1 billion
  • FY 1979 - $54.9 billion
  • FY 1978 - $72.7 billion
Gerald Ford: Added $223.7 billion, a 47.1% increase from the $475 billion debt at the end of Nixon's last budget.
  • FY 1977 - $78.4 billion
  • FY 1976 - $87.2 billion
  • FY 1975 - $58.1 billion
Richard Nixon: Added $121.3 billion, a 34.3% increase from the $353.7 billion debt at the end of President Johnson's last budget.
  • FY 1974 - $16.9 billion
  • FY 1973 - $30.8 billion
  • FY 1972 - $29.1 billion
  • FY 1971 - $27.2 billion
  • FY 1970 - $17.1 billion
Lyndon B. Johnson: Added $42 billion, a 13% increase from the $312 billion debt at the end of President Kennedy's last budget, FY 1964.
  • FY 1969 - $6.1 billion
  • FY 1968 - $21.3 billion
  • FY 1967 - $6.3 billion
  • FY 1966 - $2.6 billion
  • FY 1965 - $5.5 billion
John F. Kennedy: Added $23 billion, an 7.8% increase from the $288.9 billion debt at the end of Eisenhower's last budget.
  • FY 1964 - $5.8 billion
  • FY 1963 - $7.6 billion
  • FY 1962 - $9.2 billion
Dwight Eisenhower: Added $22.8 billion, a 8.6% increase from the $266 billion debt at the end of Truman's last budget.
  • FY 1961 - $2.6 billion
  • FY 1960 - $1.6 billion
  • FY 1959 - $8.3 billion
  • FY 1958 - $5.8 billion
  • FY 1957 - $2.2 billion surplus
  • FY 1956 - $1.6 billion surplus
  • FY 1955 - $3.1 billion
  • FY 1954 - $5.1 billion
Harry Truman: Added $7.3 billion, a 2.8% increase from the $258.6 billion debt at the end of President Roosevelt’s last budget.
  • FY 1953 - $6.9 billion
  • FY 1952 - $3.8 billion
  • FY 1951 - $2.1 billion surplus
  • FY 1950 - $4.5 billion
  • FY 1949 - $478 million surplus
  • FY 1948 - $6 billion surplus
  • FY 1947 - $11 billion surplus
  • FY 1946 - $10.7 billion
Franklin D. Roosevelt: Added $236 billion, a 1,048% increase from the $22.5 billion debt at the end of Hoover's last budget.
  • FY 1945 - $57.6 billion
  • FY 1944 - $64.3 billion
  • FY 1943 - $64.2 billion
  • FY 1942 - $23.4 billion
  • FY 1941 - $6 billion
  • FY 1940 - $2.5 billion
  • FY 1939 - $3.2 billion
  • FY 1938 - $740 million
  • FY 1937 - $2.6 billion
  • FY 1936 - $5 billion
  • FY 1935 - $1.6 billion
  • FY 1934 - $4.5 billion
Click to expand...
We can run a deficit forever. So long as it's not too large.

Inflation is the result of the government printing money.

They can print as much as they want, there's nothing stopping them.

*But* it will inevitably cause Inflation. Inflation is survivable as long as it a manageable rate. But if you print too much you'll get too much inflation.

Once you cross the threshold where people lose confidence in the currency then it's an inescapable death spiral. Your economy is done. We've seen what run away inflation looks like.

What we haven't seen is what run away Inflation looks like in the world's reserve currency. We're talking global economic collapse.

The instances of run away inflation that we have seen had a functioning global economy to allow them to "reboot".

The collapse of the worlds reserve currency could easily end up collapsing society. We could see a new "dark ages".
 
Grimscale

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Jmac00 said:
LMFAO, your delusional if you think the loony left won't blame Trump, your statement is down right laughable
Click to expand...


His statement didn't say they won't blame Trump, his statement merely said it started long before Trump became President.

Every new administration blames the previous one for all the faults they don't want to admit to. Happened with Obama, Bush, Clinton, Bush, etc.. back as far as I can remember. doesn't mean they are necessarily wrong about blaming them, either. It's all about appearances.

SonOfSun said:
The last 4 years and the next 4 years are largely irrelevant to where we are headed.
Click to expand...


fiscally I would agree with you. But there is more than just fiscal policy that determined my antipathy to a Biden Administration.

SonOfSun said:
When was Biden even a major part of this? The fiscal course this country has been on goes back decades.
Click to expand...


Yes, but it begs the question, "what did Joe Biden do to try to prevent this while he was in office?" Whether or not he was successful, did he, at least, try?

SonOfSun said:
Biden isn't going to change it.
Click to expand...

And this is also part of the problem. I don't see a Biden Administration attempting to reign in the rampant deficit spending the Federal Government is doing. I had hopes that Trump would at least attempt it, but was disappointed. I already know a Republican Administration (which would be subtly different than a Trump Admin) would not change this course. They tend to exacerbate it by cutting taxes while rampantly giving money away.
 
Saltwater60

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Blimey said:
Probably true. I’m just reeling at the idea that everyone will get this. It’s beyond reason.

Many people’s incomes are up since last year. Is this to stimulate the economy which in theory we could do by having “free”’money every month or is it to help people out? I dare so most receiving this money don’t need it at all. Deficits have to matter. So this is another $200B plus I’m guessing?
Click to expand...
It’s meant to do both.
My income is the same and we’re both working so I’ll spend the money on some stuff I need and some stuff I want. The entire check I get will get spent in the first month. Not a frivolous spender but I’ll pay off the couch we bought, and I’ll put the rest towards a car and some towards the shed I want to buy.
Others who truly need it will spend it immediately. I doubt many will save it.
 
Saltwater60

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spat said:
We can run a deficit forever. So long as it's not too large.

Inflation is the result of the government printing money.

They can print as much as they want, there's nothing stopping them.

*But* it will inevitably cause Inflation. Inflation is survivable as long as it a manageable rate. But if you print too much you'll get too much inflation.

Once you cross the threshold where people lose confidence in the currency then it's an inescapable death spiral. Your economy is done. We've seen what run away inflation looks like.

What we haven't seen is what run away Inflation looks like in the world's reserve currency. We're talking global economic collapse.

The instances of run away inflation that we have seen had a functioning global economy to allow them to "reboot".

The collapse of the worlds reserve currency could easily end up collapsing society. We could see a new "dark ages".
Click to expand...
I think Biden will worsen this by printing and handing out money and a lack of economic direction. I think the confidence in the USA and our currency will be at an all time low very soon.
 
spat

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Saltwater60 said:
I think Biden will worsen this by printing and handing out money and a lack of economic direction. I think the confidence in the USA and our currency will be at an all time low very soon.
Click to expand...
Once you cross that threshold you're done. There is no recovering.

But the government will get very desperate to try to hang on. They will institute every terrible idea in the book, and it will just dig the hole deeper.

The only course of action they could take that would lessen the impact would be to essentially dissolve as much of the government as possible without causing complete anarchy and eliminate as much spending as possible. Then let the economy burn to the ground and rebuild itself.

They will not to that. They will try to spend their way out of the disaster. They will institute price fixing. They will punish anyone who manages to avoid even a little bit of the suffering they have caused. It will be like throwing gasoline on a fire, and when it gets bigger they will say "we didn’t use enough, we need *more* gas"
 
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It did start a long time ago . depending on how far back you want to go , Some say 1913 with the founding the federal reserve, Some say 1960s with the beginning of globalism and the exportation of American factories overseas, some say the when the dollar was taken off of the gold standard in 1970 the real inflation began. Whichever way you slice it, it was a long slow process over decades. The decision was made years ago, Were going socialist. the only way that could happen was to de-industrialize the US . The US was to wealthy , they would never accept a lower standard of living .In order for globalism to work the US economy had to be destroyed.

JFK and Eisenhower warned us about it
 
FRB

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GOPerfect said:
To me it makes no difference what the day of the week is. I never tip. I hate the entire mindset of tipping. If I am out with my wife and my family they force me to leave some money I leave the absolute bare minimum.
Click to expand...

Why? That is the nature of food service, they depend on tippers.
 
GOPerfect

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FRB said:
Why? That is the nature of food service, they depend on tippers.
Click to expand...


I believe our system of tipping in the US is an incorrect system. Businesses need to just pay these people a fair wage. I have spent a lot of time oversees, no tipping needed. Pay is fair.

If I go into steak joint and order a big ol fat steak and the sides, they charge me a hefty amount for that meal, it should not be my responsibility to fund the servers paycheck.
 
FRB

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GOPerfect said:
If I go into steak joint and order a big ol fat steak and the sides, they charge me a hefty amount for that meal, it should not be my responsibility to fund the servers paycheck.
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Went to Red Lobster the other day, spent $100 looked at the food and just shook my head TOTAL RIPOFF. For the 1st time I can ever remember I did not leave a tip, all they did was carry it out to me in a bag.
 
GOPerfect

GOPerfect

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FRB said:
Went to Red Lobster the other day, spent $100 looked at the food and just shook my head TOTAL RIPOFF. For the 1st time I can ever remember I did not leave a tip, all they did was carry it out to me in a bag.
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My point exact. What do servers do? I tell them what I want, they bring it to me and they fill my glass when empty. Wow.....

At christmas time though, I do give out coffee gift cards to the mail mail and the garbage men. My garbage men are awesome. I forgot to take the cans to the curb a couple of times, they went in the backyard and took care of the trash for me.
 
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GOPerfect said:
I believe our system of tipping in the US is an incorrect system. Businesses need to just pay these people a fair wage. I have spent a lot of time oversees, no tipping needed. Pay is fair.
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I tend to agree that the tipping system is incorrect and that businesses should pay a fair wage, staff shouldn't have to rely on tips.

That being said, the laws allow businesses to structure waiter/waitress wages that way so that's how it's done. The waiters don't really have any real say in the matter, you're taking your dislike of the system out on people who have no control over that system - if you don't tip the waiters that hurts them, it doesn't hurt the parties responsible for the perpetuation of the system you disagree with.
 
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