9mm Carry Ammo

[Dr. Evil]

Critical Duty 124g. Thoughts? Either that, Speer Gold dot or Federal HST for me.

 

[Edwardteach72]

Speer Gold dots (not the G2)

Federal HST

Those are the 2 gold standards.. there are a few that follow after the... personally I'd avoid critical duty or defense.

One sec I'll find the link to a YT channel the dude does amazing calibrated gel tests

 

[Edwardteach72]

https://youtube.com/user/tnoutdoors9

 

[Edwardteach72]

Sig V-crown seemed to also do decent...

 

[Dr. Evil]

personally I'd avoid critical duty or defense.

Curious your reasons why.

 

[8w7]

Critical Duty expands less so that it can penetrate more. It would be my choice considering how large people can get nowadays.

 

[Edwardteach72]

Curious your reasons why.

I like how consistent and well both HST and Gold dots perform and both are usually (well back in the before times) super easy to get and one of the least expensive..

HST 50 round LEO boxes could be had for like $20

 

[Dr. Evil]

HST 50 round LEO boxes could be had for like $20

Where?

 

[gun_slinger_boy]

Xtreme Defense.

 

[Edwardteach72]

But also..

Critical duty > critical defense

 

[Edwardteach72]

Where?

Used to be everywhere but that was the before times

 

[Dr. Evil]

Any experience with Sig Sauer 124g V Crown? Reasonably priced and reviews seem to be good.

Sig Sauer Elite V-Crown 9mm Luger Ammunition 124 Grain Jacketed Hollow Point - E9MMA2-20

Sig Sauer Elite V-Crown 9mm Luger Ammunition 124 Grain Jacketed Hollow Point - E9MMA2-20 at Target Sports USA with free shipping available. Enjoy deal|^||^|

www.targetsportsusa.com

 

[Edwardteach72]

Any experience with Sig Sauer 124g V Crown? Reasonably priced and reviews seem to be good.

Sig Sauer Elite V-Crown 9mm Luger Ammunition 124 Grain Jacketed Hollow Point - E9MMA2-20

Sig Sauer Elite V-Crown 9mm Luger Ammunition 124 Grain Jacketed Hollow Point - E9MMA2-20 at Target Sports USA with free shipping available. Enjoy deal|^||^|

www.targetsportsusa.com

I would run it if I couldn't get hst or gold dots..

Also try a box or 2 through the gun and see how it groups

 

[Edwardteach72]

I would run it if I couldn't get hst or gold dots..

Also try a box or 2 through the gun and see how it groups

Last part goes for any carry ammo. Some guns don't like some flavors

 

[Acer-m14]

anyone on the Forum here that works in Jails / Prisons ?

do a poll .. what ammo is the best to be shot with .. lol

 

[Edwardteach72]

Here is a 50 round box of 124g hst

Pugh Self-Protection & Combatives

Pugh Self-Protection & Combatives: a premium sporting goods retailer

shop.pughselfprotection.com

 

[Acer-m14]

 

[Edwardteach72]

Gimmicky ammo is gimmicky

 

[8w7]

Gimmicky ammo is gimmicky

Yep. Penetrates 10 inches from the tests I’ve seen on YouTube.

 

[SomeSoldier]

And petals completely in the first 4 inches, only the base makes it 10 inches in gel. And I questioned the effectiveness,

BUT

I had to edit this post after seeing this:


Given the cost, I still wouldn't carry it and I have no expectation of needing to defeat body armor.

Did you miss the Buffalo supermarket shooting?

 

[Edwardteach72]

Did you miss the Buffalo supermarket shooting?

What is your point??

Because in one instance someone was wearing lvl4 body armor, so you should carry novelty ammo, instead of tested and proven ammo?

 

[SomeSoldier]

What is your point??

Because in one instance someone was wearing lvl4 body armor, so you should carry novelty ammo, instead of tested and proven ammo?

My point has nothing to do with ammo selection. I am more point out a flawed mindset.

I bet the security guard said the same thing and conditioned his brain to just worry about hitting center mass. When he should have been practicing for armored and unarmored targets.

Think outside the box.

 

[Edwardteach72]

Yep. Penetrates 10 inches from the tests I’ve seen on YouTube.

And petals completely in the first 4 inches, only the base makes it 10 inches in gel. And I questioned the effectiveness,

Yup, only the small base made it the 10ish inches.. so roughly a 25 grain projectile... (hell .177cal pellets look to get up to like 16 grains... so you have slightly better than a pellet gun)

 

[Edwardteach72]

My point has nothing to do with ammo selection. I am more point out a flawed mindset.

I bet the security guard said the same thing and conditioned his brain to just worry about hitting center mass. When he should have been practicing for armored and unarmored targets.

Think outside the box.

Using shit ammo is flawed thinking... using completely garbage ammo because of a garbage gimmick YT test that lOoOkeD cOoL is flawed thinking

 

[8w7]

If only the base after the petals break off under penetrates in gel, it will penetrate even less after defeating armor. There are better ways to take down a shooter wearing armor.

Pelvic and head shots are the way to take down an armored shooter. It requires training though.

 

[livingston]

 

[Edwardteach72]

Before I edited my post I was even more critical of the ammo. But then I watched Mac's video because I saw a more specialized purpose to it and edited to add and walked back my criticism, but the effective application of the ammo is still pretty narrow. If I determined watermelons to be a major threat, then yeah, it would be my carry choice.

The security guard was a retired cop and I'm sure trained extensively to shoot center mass, which he did. When I said I had no expectation of defeating BA, I meant it in terms of my carry ammo selection, not training. I'm playing percentages here and I'm much more likely to encounter a home invasion, car-jacking, or mugging than BA mass shooter. For BA I'll train for selected shot placement rather than trying to carry ammo to get around proper shot placement, which IMO is not just accuracy but situational awareness to select the most effective shot placement. Obviously that is not center mass on armored target, but that guard was probably so focused on the front sight he lost the ability to alter his POA. I'd gladly trade some of that 1MOA accuracy some guys shoot for in exchange for the increased situational awareness to select a more effective POA.

I hope that clarifies my position.

The problem is thinking just because it looked cool in MACs video doesn't mean it's good ammo.

If I remember correctly he shot clay with it behind the body armor. Or was it a dummy made out of gel?? If it was the latter then I bet it wasn't calibrated gel and it sure wasn't 12-18" of gel.

So oh cool him shooting gimmick crap ammo on camera looks cool and devastating and useful.. when in reality it is complete garbage and people need to stop acting like it's anything cool or has any viable use in the real world

 

[SomeSoldier]

Using shit ammo is flawed thinking... using completely garbage ammo because of a garbage gimmick YT test that lOoOkeD cOoL is flawed thinking

Where did I state which ammo to use or not use? Also I didn't even watch the video.

 

[Edwardteach72]

Oh I agree. I wouldn't use it, I was just surprised it got through the armor. Also, it was just the plate, not the whole carrier and additional clothing layers. The 7.62x25 Bulgarian surplus he shot was way more effective, but again, the application is very narrow.

There is no substitute for well rounded, proven ammo and training.

Yup and unfortunately people see this and don't understand how ballistics or ammo works. So they will think man I need this ammo.

Look ill be the first to admit thos 50grain shit was some of my first carry ammo.. actually Hornaday personal defense was my first carry ammo then I got this stuff because of macs video. Then thank God I replaced it almost immediately after doing some research

 

[fresch]

I tell the wife shoot at the balls and keep pulling the trigger, reload if needed.
I figured one of the 3 shots will hit.
She is a good shot so kind of funny but adrenaline rush.