FBI Special Agent In Charge of Whitmer Kidnap Plot is Arrested For Domestic Violence, Assault With Intent to Do Great Bodily Harm

[livingston]

The curiously sketchy case against six accused people in the FBI organized plot to kidnap Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer took another hit to the case credibility on Monday, as the lead FBI Special Agent was arrested on domestic violence charges. This latest issue comes less than a week after court filings showed twelve embedded FBI operatives were involved in the suspicious plot that culminated in the arrest of six individuals {Go Deep}.

(Detroit News) – […] FBI Special Agent Richard Trask, 39, of Kalamazoo [pictured left on Instagram], was charged Monday with assault with intent to do great bodily harm, less than murder following a domestic incident with his wife Sunday. He was released on a $10,000 personal recognizance bond following an arraignment in 8th District Court in Kalamazoo and faces a charge punishable by up to 10 years in prison.

FBI Special Agent In Charge of Whitmer Kidnap Plot is Arrested For Domestic Violence, Assault With Intent to Do Great Bodily Harm - The Last Refuge

This latest issue comes less than a week after court filings showed twelve embedded FBI operatives were involved in the suspicious plot that culminated in the arrest of six individuals

theconservativetreehouse.com

 

[PutnamCharlie]

Pretty crazy they let him out on bail for what is probably attempted murder but a regular citizen gets no bail and 8 months for trespassing. Pretty sure there is something fu**ed up with that.

 

[livingston]

court filings showed twelve embedded FBI operatives were involved in the suspicious plot that culminated in the arrest of six individuals

Folks we have a learning situation here.... First this plot was one of the most crazy plots one ever read about. This was like a make believe Hollywood script badly written .. So bad that it ends up on Sat night live .. That said If you ever are sitting in a bar and some fellow that that you never played pee wee football with ..sits next to you and starts talking shit like this agent did to have this plot... Kindly excuse yourself to go to the john and slip out the back.. Then alert all your friends about this crazy guy .

 

[tirwin1]

No, no no. Ask to see his FBI credentials and ask how many other agents are in the bar with him, lol.

 

[SomeSoldier]

Pretty crazy they let him out on bail for what is probably attempted murder but a regular citizen gets no bail and 8 months for trespassing. Pretty sure there is something fu**ed up with that.

Banana Republic

 

[Celt]

court filings showed twelve embedded FBI operatives were involved in the suspicious plot that culminated in the arrest of six individuals

Folks we have a learning situation here.... First this plot was one of the most crazy plots one ever read about. This was like a make believe Hollywood script badly written .. So bad that it ends up on Sat night live .. That said If you ever are sitting in a bar and some fellow that that you never played pee wee football with ..sits next to you and starts talking shit like this agent did to have this plot... Kindly excuse yourself to go to the john and slip out the back.. Then alert all your friends about this crazy guy .

Youre not kidding.

I dont have issues with undercover ops to expose real bad guys. I do have issues with infiltrators that INSTIGATE illegal behavior on easily manipulated people and then arrest those people for it.

 

[tirwin1]

Youre not kidding.

I dont have issues with undercover ops to expose real bad guys. I do have issues with infiltrators that INSTIGATE illegal behavior on easily manipulated people and then arrest those people for it.

Instigated with the purpose of generating headlines that keep people in fear and to increase the agency's budget.

I believe there is more demand for domestic terrorists than there is supply. Same thing with racism.

 

[SomeSoldier]

Youre not kidding.

I dont have issues with undercover ops to expose real bad guys. I do have issues with infiltrators that INSTIGATE illegal behavior on easily manipulated people and then arrest those people for it.

Its usually called entrapment.

 

[S&W Fan]

Its USED to be called entrapment.

FIFY

 

[Truebeliever]

Pretty crazy they let him out on bail for what is probably attempted murder but a regular citizen gets no bail and 8 months for trespassing. Pretty sure there is something fu**ed up with that.

Bodily harm LESS than murder. I don’t think that’s a attempted murder charge. If he broke her arm that would be great bodily harm in some jurisdictions.

 

[Truebeliever]

Its usually called entrapment.

It might be entrapment but that is an affirmative defense. Unlike a self defense claim where the prosecution must convince the jury it was NOT self defense. The defense must convince a jury that they were coerced into doing it beyond given an opportunity to do it. It’s very hard to prove it . The assumption of innocence is destroyed by his own defense. Then the burden of proof is on him

 

[spat]

It might be entrapment but that is an affirmative defense. Unlike a self defense claim where the prosecution must convince the jury it was NOT self defense. The defense must convince a jury that they were coerced into doing it beyond given an opportunity to do it. It’s very hard to prove it . The assumption of innocence is destroyed by his own defense. Then the burden of proof is on him

Self defense is also an affirmative defense in most jurisdictions that I am aware of.

 

[SomeSoldier]

It might be entrapment but that is an affirmative defense. Unlike a self defense claim where the prosecution must convince the jury it was NOT self defense. The defense must convince a jury that they were coerced into doing it beyond given an opportunity to do it. It’s very hard to prove it . The assumption of innocence is destroyed by his own defense. Then the burden of proof is on him

Doesn't make it any less entrapment. Not saying its easy to prove but it appears to be their MO as of late.

 

[Truebeliever]

Self defense is also an affirmative defense in most jurisdictions that I am aware of.

No, self defense is not an affirmative defense. The burden of proof is still on the prosecution. The defense can just say “ self defense” and the prosecution must prove it was not.

In a entrapment affirmative defense, not only must the defense show that the government created the opportunity for the defendant to commit the crime but that it was too enticing for the defendant to say no.

For example, if someone offered you heroin, most people would say no, therefore if the undercover government agent offered it to you, you would say no. It’s not entrapment.

Now , if the defendant could prove he was addicted to heroin and desperate, then the government offered him some- that might be entrapment. The defense would have the burden of proving that addiction and that it was so powerful he couldn’t say no.

 

[spat]

No, self defense is not an affirmative defense. The burden of proof is still on the prosecution. The defense can just say “ self defense” and the prosecution must prove it was not.

In a entrapment affirmative defense, not only must the defense show that the government created the opportunity for the defendant to commit the crime but that it was too enticing for the defendant to say no.

For example, if someone offered you heroin, most people would say no, therefore if the undercover government agent offered it to you, you would say no. It’s not entrapment.

Now , if the defendant could prove he was addicted to heroin and desperate, then the government offered him some- that might be entrapment. The defense would have the burden of proving that addiction and that it was so powerful he couldn’t say no.

If that's the case in NY it is very unusual. Typically self defense is an affirmative defense.

Even if NY law technically says it's not, I think practically it must be. NY is not a very "self defense" friendly jurisdiction.

 

[Truebeliever]

Doesn't make it any less entrapment. Not saying its easy to prove but it appears to be their MO as of late.

No, the government offering something isn’t entrapment. It’s if the offer could entice an innocent man to do the crime, then it would be entrapment.
For example, if the government agent said let’s sell drugs , you would say no.

Now if that government agent said , here is a million dollars just to help me sell it just once, that might be entrapment.

If that's the case in NY it is very unusual. Typically self defense is an affirmative defense.

Even if NY law technically says it's not, I think practically it must be. NY is not a very "self defense" friendly jurisdiction.

No, technically you are correct.

It depends on your definition of affirmative defense. Some would say it’s when one asserts something as opposed to when one has to prove what they assert.

In reality it’s not beyond a defense lawyer saying saying self defense, and for the prosecution to prove it wasn’t . As opposed to insanity which would require an actual defense and that burden is on the defense.

 

[spat]

No, the government offering something isn’t entrapment. It’s if the offer could entice an innocent man to do the crime, then it would be entrapment.
For example, if the government agent said let’s sell drugs , you would say no.

Now if that government agent said , here is a million dollars just to help me sell it just once, that might be entrapment.

No, technically you are correct.

It depends on your definition of affirmative defense. Some would say it’s when one asserts something as opposed to when one has to prove what they assert.

In reality it’s not beyond a defense lawyer saying saying self defense, and for the prosecution to prove it wasn’t . As opposed to insanity which would require an actual defense and that burden is on the defense.

Realistically I think it's always going to be a bit messy with something like self defense because it's so subjective.

Both the prosecutor and the defense are competing to convince the jury that their idea of what a "reasonable person" would do is the right one.

It's not so much something provable as it's a narrative you're trying to sell.

 

[BerettaGuy]

Speaking from personal experience here: FBI agents are not cops.

 

[Truebeliever]

Realistically I think it's always going to be a bit messy with something like self defense because it's so subjective.

Both the prosecutor and the defense are competing to convince the jury that their idea of what a "reasonable person" would do is the right one.

It's not so much something provable as it's a narrative you're trying to sell.

You haven’t seen a self defense trial then. Unlike entrapment, a self defense claim only has raise a reasonable doubt.
The judge’s instructions for entrapment will give the defense the burden of overcoming reasonable doubt.

 

[spat]

You haven’t seen a self defense trial then. Unlike entrapment, a self defense claim only has raise a reasonable doubt.
The judge’s instructions for entrapment will give the defense the burden of overcoming reasonable doubt.

The judge can instruct what he wants, at the end of the day it's 2 sets of lawyers trying to convince a jury to see their perspective and not their opponents.

Just look at Zimmerman. One set of facts that everyone agrees on, but half the country thinks his actions were so reasonable that even holding the trial was ridiculous, and the other half think he got away with murder.

Some times the judge's instructions make all the difference, but when it comes to self defense, it's more like who's lawyer is the better salesman.

 

[Acer-m14]

Men accused in plot to kidnap Michigan Gov. Whitmer claim FBI set them up

The men accused of plotting to kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer last September claim they were set up by the FBI because of their conservative political views.

nypost.com

 

[BerettaGuy]

Men accused in plot to kidnap Michigan Gov. Whitmer claim FBI set them up

The men accused of plotting to kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer last September claim they were set up by the FBI because of their conservative political views.

nypost.com

The FBI "makes" cases with "informants" who when asked a question like, Have you ever heard anyone talk about a militia? or whatever, If the guy knows someone, the race is on. A year later, headlines are made. Militia leader arrested by FBI in gun-running probe. They had their informant sell the guy a FBI supplied "stolen" gun illegally and boom. Case Closed. It is what they do.

 

[Acer-m14]

 

[Truebeliever]

The judge can instruct what he wants, at the end of the day it's 2 sets of lawyers trying to convince a jury to see their perspective and not their opponents.

Just look at Zimmerman. One set of facts that everyone agrees on, but half the country thinks his actions were so reasonable that even holding the trial was ridiculous, and the other half think he got away with murder.

Some times the judge's instructions make all the difference, but when it comes to self defense, it's more like who's lawyer is the better salesman.

The judge’s instructions actually can be quite limited and the defense argument can be limited as well.
For example, an insanity defense, an affirmative defense, will not be allowed without the defense presenting “evidence” of such. As opposed to self defense which can be raised without the defense presenting any case at all.
And unlike those “ affirmative defenses”, the defense does not necessarily have admit their client did anything.

For example,

Southwest Airlines Flight 1763 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

If the government decided to charge someone in that case, would they have to admit killing him? No, but could introduce self defense via saying others on the plane had a motive to kill the man in defense of their own lives.

 

[GOPerfect]

Men accused in plot to kidnap Michigan Gov. Whitmer claim FBI set them up

The men accused of plotting to kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer last September claim they were set up by the FBI because of their conservative political views.

nypost.com

I do not believe one can be set up in a case like this.

So, you and your mates are at the bar, drinking and playing pool. Guy comes in and starts talking and is rather friendly. He fits in with your crowd well.

You invite in the next weekend to hang out more. A friendship is created.

After a few months, this new friend, undercover FBI Agent, says, "Hey, I think we should kidnap the Governor of Michigan". Who is with me?"

 

[repete]

I do not believe one can be set up in a case like this.

So, you and your mates are at the bar, drinking and playing pool. Guy comes in and starts talking and is rather friendly. He fits in with your crowd well.

You invite in the next weekend to hang out more. A friendship is created.

After a few months, this new friend, undercover FBI Agent, says, "Hey, I think we should kidnap the Governor of Michigan". Who is with me?"

And the reply would be,. YEAH right, and lets hold her on the moon! Dude WTF have you been smokin?

 

[GOPerfect]

And the reply would be,. YEAH right, and lets hold her on the moon! Dude WTF have you been smokin?

In order to be entrapped, you must first want.

 

[Deplorable Me]

The FBI forum monitor got busted?

 

[spat]

In order to be entrapped, you must first want.

That's true, but just wanting is not a crime (yet).

If no actual criminal activity would have occurred without the FBI's help, then it's entrapment, and the FBI is a greater danger to the public than the "criminals".

 

[Truebeliever]

That's true, but just wanting is not a crime (yet).

If no actual criminal activity would have occurred without the FBI's help, then it's entrapment, and the FBI is a greater danger to the public than the "criminals".

Not true. The standard is that it would have to be so enticing that a person could not resist the offer to be entrapment.
For example, a female undercover dressed like a hooker is enticing but most married men could resist hitting on her. Now if the female undercover gave a guarantee of sex for reasonable sum of money then a mighty man might crumble especially if she is hot. That’s why they wait for the “John” to mention money. But standing on a street corner as a hooker isn’t entrapment.