Ukraine - Russia Conflict (Original Title: Things are heating up in the Donbass)

Blimey

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Mosinitis said:
After initial Russophobic hysteria fizzles out, people will start asking questions. Some already do.
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Your parents pulled you to the USA from that part of the world because they knew better, and all you do is shit on your new country, too scared to ever move back because all you are is talk. You're the very worst kind of immigrant: come to a new country and shit all over it year after year. You have spent your life defending the country that is now starting up a new genocide in europe, and you still can't get your hand off your dick every time you see a picture of putin.

Go home if you love it over there so much. Had you done so a while back you could be in the ukraine now murdering women and children for the glory of putin.

I swear with you guys the victim mentality is bred into you at birth.

I immigrated to the USA much later than you and if I didn't like it here I'd fuck off back home. Man up.
 
Dr. Evil

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holdover

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Blimey said:
At the end of the day Russia has now lost in a month what it took a decade in Afghanistan to lose. Things are not going to plan. There is no great strategy here. No 5D chess.
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That may be true, but they are far from beat. There's a lot of weird stuff goin on in the war That goes against every military principle there is.
Lot's of generals are baffled at whats happening. Its very possible they did hold back thier top units because they were afraid of NATO entering the war . If you look at the numbers before the war, they had over one miilion man army. they sent 200K into Ukraine, 50,000 casualties total, thats 25% of what they sent in. A heavy cost, no doubt. but not beaten , not by a long shot.

Now that Mariupol is just about finished they will turn most likely North .

If you watch CNN it looks like the Ukrainians lost nothing but civilians .14,000 troops in the Azoz batallion reduced to 6000 , armed civilians and mercenaries, unknown . Ukis got a bloody nose too.
 
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Drinkthekoolaid

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holdover said:
That may be true, but they are far from beat. There's a lot of weird stuff goin on in the war That goes against every military principle there is.
Lot's of generals are baffled at whats happening. Its very possible they did hold back thier top units because they were afraid of NATO entering the war . If you look at the numbers before the war, they had over one miilion man army. they sent 200K into Ukraine, 50,000 casualties total, thats 25% of what they sent in. A heavy cost, no doubt. but not beaten , not by a long shot.

Now that Mariupol is just about finished they will turn most likely North .

If you watch CNN it looks like the Ukrainians lost nothing but civilians .14,000 troops in the Azoz batallion reduced to 6000 , armed civilians and mercenaries, unknown . Ukis got a bloody nose too.
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Where is spetsnaz? They have a huge special force but it seems they have not been deployed, or only in small numbers
 
Mosinitis

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Blimey said:
At the end of the day Russia has now lost in a month what it took a decade in Afghanistan to lose. Things are not going to plan. There is no great strategy here. No 5D chess.
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I wouldn't trust British sources on anything big or small. Lying is in the British DNA. Tabloid culture.
Russia is the only country that has actual casualties count. So there, believe it or not.

www.rt.com

Moscow offers update on casualties from Ukraine conflict

The Russian military has provided a rare update on the toll of the ongoing conflict with Ukraine
www.rt.com www.rt.com
 
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Acer-m14

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togmaster said:
When the smoke clears from this shit show who is going to rebuild Ukraine? I have a strong feeling it will be you and me through our tax dollars.
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Hiroshima, Japan .... then and now ..

bdddc85e-dc7d-45e4-9964-f84d56ca14ba.jpg



anyone got photos of Detroit USA then and NOW ?? ..
 
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He (Putin)accused the authorities in Kyiv of persecuting Russian speakers and of preparing a "blitzkrieg" against the breakaway regions of Donetsk and Lugansk in Ukraine's east.

"As for those who seized and hold power in Kyiv, we demand an immediate end to their military operations," Putin said.

"Otherwise, all responsibility for the possible continuation of bloodshed will be fully on the conscience of the regime in power in Ukraine."

Putin said it was necessary to "take a long overdue decision, to immediately recognise the independence" of the two regions.

He then signed partnership agreements with the rebels that declared the presence of Russian military forces "necessary to maintain peace... and ensure reliable security."


To immediately recognise the independence" of the two regions.

“Our plans do not include the occupation of Ukrainian territories.

Russian President Vladimir Putin has ordered Russian troops to eastern Ukraine's two breakaway regions to conduct, quote, "peacekeeping operations." The move came shortly after Putin said Russia would recognize the independence of those two separatist regions in eastern Ukraine.


“What I think is important to emphasise further is that the leading NATO countries, in order to achieve their own goals, support extreme nationalists and Neo-Nazis in Ukraine, who, in turn, will never forgive the Crimeans and Sevastopol residents for choosing reunification with Russia.

“They, of course, will crawl into the Crimea, just like in the Donbas, in order to kill, just as the gangs of Ukrainian nationalists, Hitler’s accomplices, killed defenceless people during the Great Patriotic War. They openly lay claim to a number of other Russian territories.


“Its goal is to protect people who have been subjected to abuse and genocide by the regime in Kyiv for eight years. And for this we will pursue the demilitarisation and denazification of Ukraine, as well as bringing to justice those who committed numerous bloody crimes against civilians, including citizens of the Russian Federation.


“Our plans do not include the occupation of Ukrainian territories. We are not going to impose anything on anyone by force. At the same time, we hear that recently in the West there is talk that the documents signed by the Soviet totalitarian regime, securing the outcome of World War II, should no longer be upheld.

They deceived us,” he said.

The push beyond territories already controlled by Russian proxies marked a dramatic escalation in a crisis that has pitted Moscow against the West



If there is any truth to what the objectives are, the operation in the Ukraine makes a hell of a lot more sense from a military point of view


If the stated aim of the objective was to protect and defend the two separatist states then a whole lot of things now come into focus.

First off, as stated, this was not an invasion to take over the whole Ukraine like we were told .

The objectives were to never take the cities .The objectives were to pin down the Ukraine army far away from the Donbass and Western Ukraine

The objective as stated was take out enemies of the Donbas in Mariupol.

Thats why the power is still on in Kiev, and most of Ukraine.

Thats why Russian airpower hasnt been bombing the shit out of those cites.

Thats why he hasn't encircled the major cities

Thats why he sent conscripts to pressure Kiev, He had no intention of taking it .

Thats why they sent Chechens to Mariupol instead of Kiev

Thats why there was no invasion of Odessa, The goal was to pin down Ukraine troops there

Thats why a lot of things didnt make sense to anyone. Because we were told it was an all out invasion of Ukraine, It wasn't.


The western press is now changing the narritive:


Russia reframes war goals as Ukrainians advance near Kyiv​


BUCHA/LVIV, Ukraine (Reuters) - Moscow signalled on Friday it was scaling back its ambitions in Ukraine to focus on territory claimed by Russian-backed separatists in the East as Ukrainian forces went on the offensive to recapture towns outside the capital Kyiv.

In an announcement that appeared to indicate more limited goals, the Russian Defence Ministry said a first phase of its operation was mostly complete and it would now focus on the eastern Donbass region, which has pro-Russia separatist enclaves.

"The combat potential of the Armed Forces of Ukraine has been considerably reduced, which ... makes it possible to focus our core efforts on achieving the main goal, the liberation of Donbass," said Sergei Rudskoi, head of the Russian General Staff's Main Operational Directorate.


This has been Russias stated goal the entire time, Russia didnt change the goals, the west changed the story.

Watch how this is spun::


Reframing Russia's goals may make it easier for President Vladimir Putin to claim a face-saving victory, military analysts said. Moscow had said its goals included demilitarising Ukraine. Western officials dismiss this as a baseless pretext for a war they say is aimed at toppling Ukraine's government.

Facing stiff resistance, Russian troops have failed to capture any major city in the month since invading Ukraine. Instead, they have bombarded cities, laid waste to urban areas and driven a quarter of Ukraine's 44 million people from their homes.

If the goal was to destroy the enemies of the Donbass and protect the separatists regions as stated before the war began , then this is a bunch of bullshit .


I could never wrap my head around what the Russians were doing or not doing because the intentions and objectives were completely different from what I was lead to believe.

If what Im saying is true, the troops in Mariupol, will not make a drive on Odessa, , or Kieve, they will move North in the west and roll up the entire flank of the Ukraine army near the Donbass in the west. Bet me!

My position is that the western media completely lied about the intentions of Russia in the Ukraine. When viewed through this lens , Russians actions makes much more sense .


I know you guys are going to hate on me , but if you take what Russia said at face value, Thats exactly whats happened. Not smoothly, but inline with what they said.
 
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Catskillkid

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Biden says Putin ‘cannot remain in power’ as he assures Ukraine: ‘We stand with you’

Biden in a speech in Poland has come out and said that Putin cannot stay in power. Apparently the White House press corps is trying to walk back these comments (not quite sure how you do that as his words seem pretty clear to me).

This is incredibly belligerent. Losing power is perhaps the one thing that Putin fears most. If Biden keeps this up he's pushing Putin into a corner and there's not coming back where that comes from.
 
Phazer

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Catskillkid said:
Biden says Putin ‘cannot remain in power’ as he assures Ukraine: ‘We stand with you’

Biden in a speech in Poland has come out and said that Putin cannot stay in power. Apparently the White House press corps is trying to walk back these comments (not quite sure how you do that as his words seem pretty clear to me).

This is incredibly belligerent. Losing power is perhaps the one thing that Putin fears most. If Biden keeps this up he's pushing Putin into a corner and there's not coming back where that comes from.
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This was more of a statement of the obvious.

After Putin's naked aggression into a sovereign nation, that had not threatened him, where he killed civilians and destroyed cities, it is impossible for the community of civil nations to normalize relations with Russia as long as the instigator of international violence remains in power.

Whether or not we and our allies actually give a damn about Ukraine, we cannot tolerate military conquest against independent countries with elected governments. Actions have consequences.

Once peace is attained, we will have to maintain sanctions against Russia for a long as Putin is Russia's leader.
 
Phazer

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Of course....

"Shortly after Biden's address however, the White House denied that Biden was calling for regime change.

"The President’s point was that Putin cannot be allowed to exercise power over his neighbors or the region. He was not discussing Putin’s power in Russia, or regime change," a White House official told Fox News Digital shortly after the speech concluded."

www.foxnews.com

Biden says Putin ‘cannot remain in power’ as he assures Ukraine: ‘We stand with you’

President Biden on Saturday said that Russian President Vladimir Putin "cannot remain in power," as he declared the Russian invasion of Ukraine a "strategic failure" while pledging continued support for the embattled Ukrainian people.
www.foxnews.com www.foxnews.com
 
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Phazer said:
This was more of a statement of the obvious.

After Putin's naked aggression into a sovereign nation, that had not threatened him, where he killed civilians and destroyed cities, it is impossible for the community of civil nations to normalize relations with Russia as long as the instigator of international violence remains in power.

Whether or not we and our allies actually give a damn about Ukraine, we cannot tolerate military conquest against independent countries with elected governments. Actions have consequences.

Once peace is attained, we will have to maintain sanctions against Russia for a long as Putin is Russia's leader.
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But We can? hypocrisy much?
 
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holdover

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Phazer said:
Of course....

"Shortly after Biden's address however, the White House denied that Biden was calling for regime change.

"The President’s point was that Putin cannot be allowed to exercise power over his neighbors or the region. He was not discussing Putin’s power in Russia, or regime change," a White House official told Fox News Digital shortly after the speech concluded."

www.foxnews.com

Biden says Putin ‘cannot remain in power’ as he assures Ukraine: ‘We stand with you’

President Biden on Saturday said that Russian President Vladimir Putin "cannot remain in power," as he declared the Russian invasion of Ukraine a "strategic failure" while pledging continued support for the embattled Ukrainian people.
www.foxnews.com www.foxnews.com
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You cant un-ring a bell.
 
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