holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
I'd rather see him douse himself in gasoline and set himself on fire as a real protest, (of course it might be expensive)
Ukraine - Russia Conflict (Original Title: Things are heating up in the Donbass)
- Thread starter holdover
- Start date
spat
.950 JDJ
Dude is in the middle of leading his country in a war for it's very existence.What a F'in Joke!
How much of a self important bitch do you have to be to think an invitation to your silly award show is a good use of his time.
Imagine asking Churchhill to host the oscars in the middle of the blitz....
spat
.950 JDJ
If they think Ukraine is putting up resistance, I'm looking forward to seeing what the land of Vlad the Impaler has in store.
War should not be civilized. It should not be conducted, but if it can't be avoided, it should be as brutal and horrific as possible, to discourage a future attempt.
The problem with the west is that we try to conduct diplomacy and combat at the same time.
spat
.950 JDJ
He's not wrong.
pjzwtl
.308 Win
Damn someone needs a Snickers bar
All,
If you cannot be civil try stepping away from the keyboard. If that doesn’t work go somewhere and scream. Just don’t bring it here.
There's plenty of "bad and wrong" on both sides. Neither are infallible. Neither are all good nor are they all bad.
I can't imagine I would appreciate soldiers from (insert country here) invading my country. I like to think I would be honorable but until I'm in that position I don't know how much anger or revenge I would be seeking. I dunno maybe if my actual home was bombed or my family hurt I would be vindictive.
war sucks and it sucks even more we're in this position because this entire conflict was avoidable. I genuinely think the west prodded this conflict along. It's not to justify Putin, because he invaded another sovereign nation but the west "kept poking the bear" (yes dad joke) and should share in the blame.
spat
.950 JDJ
If I'm defending myself from an attacker (as the Ukrainians are) I have no intention of trying to conduct myself honorably. I intend to be as sneaky, underhanded and brutal as I can.
In something as wide ranging as an invasion like this, nobody and nothing would be off limits.
Something to ponder....
This is something largely not being discussed...
Perhaps we're looking at this conflict the wrong way.
First, Keep in mind that the western media that we see is doing everything possible to show Ukraine in the best possible light and it runs the spectrum from propoganda to full out digitally manipulated lies and extreme exaggerations. So keep in mind the west is getting a very "selective" story on events and the course of the war.
Did you guys know Ukraines army was effectively bigger (armed soldiers and number of tanks) than European NATO (excluding the US). The Ukrainian army was arguably the strongest army in Europe and had recent widespread combat experience and it was given billions of dollars of aid consisting of top of the line western anti tank and anti air systems.
Russia is still slogging along making advances and degrading the Ukrainian capabilities.
Russia still has massive amounts of soldiers and armor not deployed. I think they still have like 1.5 million soldiers and a crap ton of tanks and armor.
I still think Russia did not send it's A team to the fight. I don't see or hear of widespread usage of airborne or spetsnaz troops. Those are well trained hardened troops that are not appearing to be used. To me it almost seems like Russia is using this conflict as an opportunity to harden and experience for their regular troops while holding back their better units. What if it's not a coincidence and it's by design to prepare their forces for war with NATO?
Knowing Russia is beating the largest army in Europe with their B team shouldn't be overlooked. Sure Russia has some overly reported blunders and losses but hey that's the cost of doing business to gain experience.
Just a thought
This is something largely not being discussed...
Perhaps we're looking at this conflict the wrong way.
First, Keep in mind that the western media that we see is doing everything possible to show Ukraine in the best possible light and it runs the spectrum from propoganda to full out digitally manipulated lies and extreme exaggerations. So keep in mind the west is getting a very "selective" story on events and the course of the war.
Did you guys know Ukraines army was effectively bigger (armed soldiers and number of tanks) than European NATO (excluding the US). The Ukrainian army was arguably the strongest army in Europe and had recent widespread combat experience and it was given billions of dollars of aid consisting of top of the line western anti tank and anti air systems.
Russia is still slogging along making advances and degrading the Ukrainian capabilities.
Russia still has massive amounts of soldiers and armor not deployed. I think they still have like 1.5 million soldiers and a crap ton of tanks and armor.
I still think Russia did not send it's A team to the fight. I don't see or hear of widespread usage of airborne or spetsnaz troops. Those are well trained hardened troops that are not appearing to be used. To me it almost seems like Russia is using this conflict as an opportunity to harden and experience for their regular troops while holding back their better units. What if it's not a coincidence and it's by design to prepare their forces for war with NATO?
Knowing Russia is beating the largest army in Europe with their B team shouldn't be overlooked. Sure Russia has some overly reported blunders and losses but hey that's the cost of doing business to gain experience.
Just a thought
No, those videos are Russian disinformation.
I was referring to the Ukrainians shooting the Russian prisoners
So, this kind of action would have been okay if the afghans and Iraqi soldiers/fighters did this to the American soldiers that invaded their countries?
spat
.950 JDJ
Didn't they ?
OK is not really the right word for it. You can't get involved in a no rules fight and then complain that your enemy isn't following the rules.
If the Taliban hadn't tried to harbor Bin Laden they would have been allowed to continue oppress their people in peace. They were an accessory after the fact for 9/11.
The point is there are no rules for this. We can pretend there are, and hamstring ourselves, but that doesn't mean we can expect the enemy to. Human decency is not a factor once you've decided killing people is OK, then so is everything else, and I mean everything.
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
This only leads to reciprocation, not good . During WW2 An American airborne unit was captured near a town called Malmedy , The Germans executed The American POWS. When Eisenhower heard about it , He issued orders that the unit responsible was not to be taken prisoner. The Americans finally caught up with the Unit and executed their orders along with a lot of Germans .
On the Eastern front it was common for both sides to not take prisoners. This makes a bad situation worse. and its a war crime punishable by death.
So, all of my fellow Veterans that did not make it home these past twenty+ years, you are okay with them being killed?
Great to know.
holdover
.475 A&M Magnum
No. They agreed to hand over Bin Laden But thier laws required the proper evidence to do so.
Steal2B
.700 Nitro Express
Did I say that?
I'm not OK with it. Outside of giving Osama a dirt nap we shouldn't have even been there. All thousands of those soldiers that died and countless more injured should have been at home instead of in the far away sand box. So no, I'm not OK with that.
However, I also don't blame a people for defending themselves from a hostile invader by any means necessary. We did invade those countries and them fighting back is a rational response - as rational as you fighting back if someone invaded your home or country.
You mean like public videos of him claiming his organization did it at his command? Get real they had no intention of handing him over.
"No sympathy.
Simple solution, don't want to die? Don't invade other countries."
These are your words, correct. You appear to be okay with Soldiers being killed due to an invasion.
Okay in the Russia/Ukraine thing, but not okay for the US Soldiers?
Just trying to get things straight.
If that is your opinion, okay,.
ArmedCorgi
.475 A&M Magnum
I don't think this is prep for a move against NATO. I also don't think nukes will be used unless WE provoke the situation that way. The simplest answer is usually the correct one. I think what is going on is more like what @holdover said in post #3619.
There is nuance in everything, but generally speaking if you are an unwanted invader trying to seize control of someone else's home/country then you deserve whatever response you get from them. If that's them leaving the invader's dead to become dog chow, so be it. If someone came to my home and tried to take it, there is nothing that I wouldn't consider doing to repel them. I have to ask, what wouldn't you do to protect your family?