Ukraine - Russia Conflict (Original Title: Things are heating up in the Donbass)

[spat]

You need to be reminded how U.S. couldn't win Korean war, even before NK had nukes.

And you need to be reminded that the only reason the US hasn't obliterated every enemy since WWII is that we just didn't want to kill too many of them.

Vietnam, Afghanistan, etc... were all a matter of is deciding we're not going to just kill them all.

 

[Mosinitis]

We "could" have but chose not to do what was needed. And don't forget about literal human waves of screaming china men pouring over the yellow river heading southward.


But I'm certainly not discounting Nk Today. They are an impoverished hard militaristic culture where duty and sacrifice are engrained in the DNA from birth. They lack sophistication but make up for it in intangibles. In a straight up fight with no allies just NK vs SK I think I like NKs chances if I had to bet and choose one.

Could have doesn't count.

 

[spat]

Could have doesn't count.

It certainly better when people are considering whether they want to get into it with the US or not.

 

[Mosinitis]

It certainly better when people are considering whether they want to get into it with the US or not.

There is a long record of U.S. not winning wars. Starting with Korea and up.

 

[spat]

There is a long record of U.S. not winning wars. Starting with Korea and up.

Sure, sure, how have things worked out for the people who "won" those wars ?

The US doesn't lose wars. We get bored and go home.

 

[Bigfoot]

MASCOT (Message Alert System for Citizens Overseas Tool) Update –​

U.S. Embassy Kyiv, Ukraine​

Message for U.S. Citizens in Ukraine

Security Alert: U.S. Embassy Kyiv, Ukraine (November 20, 2024)

Location: Ukraine, all districts



Event: The U.S. Embassy in Kyiv has received specific information of a potential significant air attack on November 20. Out of an abundance of caution, the Embassy will be closed, and Embassy employees are being instructed to shelter in place. The U.S. Embassy recommends U.S. citizens be prepared to immediately shelter in the event an air alert is announced.

Technical Difficulties

- The link works, just saying.

 

[holdover]

I dont know how accurate this is,.


""The ATACMS season may not last long for Ukraine": Kiev has a maximum of fifty American long-range missiles, so Forbes advises "enjoying" them until Trump comes to power."

 

[MothMan]

Escalation??

Putin says Russia attacked Ukraine with a new missile that he claims the West can't stop

Russian President Vladimir Putin says Moscow has tested a new intermediate-range missile in a strike on Ukraine and that it could use the weapon against countries that have allowed Kyiv to use their missiles to strike Russia.

apnews.com

 

[MothMan]

RS-28 Sarmat - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Mosinitis]

 

[holdover]

That was a final fuck you from Joey Biden, much to do about nothing. Im sure Zelenski will release everything he has at Moscow once he knows its all over, which will be sometime next year. It wouldnt surprise me if the Ukraine generals turn on him . Theres no further point in the wasteing of lives and money property with no possibility of winning

 

[Robin]

Well, short of using nuclear bombs, does it really matter how innocent people are murdered in an unjust war against their sovereignty?
Robin

 

[holdover]

Well, short of using nuclear bombs, does it really matter how innocent people are murdered
Robin

Well its surely a tragedy of every war.

As far as Im concerned, the war was started By NATO and a Ukrainian puppet, and the Russians were justified .

 

[spat]

Well its surely a tragedy of every war.

As far as Im concerned, the war was started By NATO and a Ukrainian puppet, and the Russians were justified .

Utterly ridiculous.

NATO started this war by
(checks notes) acting too friendly to Ukraine ?

If that's true, then surely NATO would be justified in steamrolling through Belarus because they're too friendly with Russia, right ?

 

[Robin]

Truly amazing, callous, bordering on delusional, and beyond words.
Robin

 

[Drinkthekoolaid]

Expect more Russian IRBMs and/or ICBM strikes.

Some of the same obscure web osint reports that discussed Russia planning to use their missiles the other day now say with Putin's recent warnings, and apparently there was some closed door meeting in the Kremlin in the middle of the night Russia time there are reports of more road mobile ballistic missile movement

 

[spat]

Expect more Russian IRBMs and/or ICBM strikes.

Some of the same obscure web osint reports that discussed Russia planning to use their missiles the other day now say with Putin's recent warnings, and apparently there was some closed door meeting in the Kremlin in the middle of the night Russia time there are reports of more road mobile ballistic missile movement

How many can Russia afford to fire ?

Those missiles aren't cheap.

 

[FP1201]

Utterly ridiculous.

NATO started this war by
(checks notes) acting too friendly to Ukraine ?

If that's true, then surely NATO would be justified in steamrolling through Belarus because they're too friendly with Russia, right ?

could be...also could be that NATO played both sides against each other to weaken and strain their resources, lessening possible future threats while opening a door for looting disguised as relief.

 

[spat]

could be...also could be that NATO played both sides against each other to weaken and strain their resources, lessening possible future threats while opening a door for looting disguised as relief.

You're probably correct on that one.

I'm not sure blaming all of NATO for some CIA scheme is quite fair, but the gist of it is right.

But, they setup the bait and Putin fell right into the trap. All he had to do was keep his troops on his own side or the border.

So, regardless or what manipulation the CIA was engaging in, the actual crime here was the invasion, and that is 100% on Putin.

If some guy dares you to rob a bank, and keeps pointing out all the juicy money in it, it's still your fault when you rob it.

 

[livingston]

Russia’s Top Diplomat: Biden Ukraine Moves Trying to ‘Muck Things Up’ for Trump​

“It seems that this desire, let’s say, to muck things up, can be seen in the current situation,” Lavrov added, going on to say that sabotaging their successors is “typical of the Democrats” and accusing former President Barack Obama of similarly attempting to “pull the same trick” on Trump before leaving office.


“He [Obama] expelled dozens of Russian diplomats, some 120 people, including their family members,” Lavrov recalled. “What’s more, he demanded they leave Washington on a day when there were no direct flights from Washington, so they had to take a six-hour bus ride all the way to New York with their small children and belongings. In other words, they made things very uncomfortable.”

Russia's Top Diplomat: Biden Ukraine Moves Trying to 'Muck Things Up' for Trump

Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov accused outgoing President Joe Biden of trying to "muck things up" for Trump.

www.breitbart.com

 

[GOYABEAN]

Not sure if this been posted

How lies become facts and the world ends |

www.paulcraigroberts.org

 

[Mosinitis]

Just a reminder to selective memory crowd. Russia invaded Ukraine after Ukraine refused to abide by signed Minsk agreements and stepped up the shelling of Russian population in Donbas. There were other demands, but that alone justified Russian invasion.

 

[spat]

Just a reminder to selective memory crowd. Russia invaded Ukraine after Ukraine refused to abide by signed Minsk agreements and stepped up the shelling of Donbas Russian population. There were other demands, but that alone justifies Russian invasion.

Just a reminder, the principle part of that agreement was that Ukraine give up their nukes in exchange for security guarantees from Russia and the US.

Bet nobody ever does that again.

Remind me again what Ukraine got out of that deal ?

 

[Mosinitis]

Just a reminder, the principle part of that agreement was that Ukraine give up their nukes in exchange for security guarantees from Russia and the US.

Bet nobody ever does that again.

Remind me again what Ukraine got out of that deal ?

Minsk agreements had nothing to do with nukes.

Ukraine never had nukes to give up. Soviet nuclear arsenal belonged to Russian Federation as Internationally recognized successor of the Soviet Union along with all of the nuclear treaties made by the Soviet Union.

 

[spat]

Minsk agreements had nothing to do with nukes.

Ukraine never had nukes to give up. Soviet nuclear arsenal belonged to Russian Federation as Internationally recognized successor of the Soviet Union along with all of the nuclear treaties made by the Soviet Union.

Lol, sure.

Soviet union broke up.

Nukes that Ukraine built and were stored in Ukraine still belonged to Russia.

I bet if Ukraine builds some more you'll claim Russia owns them too.

 

[Mosinitis]

Lol, sure.

Soviet union broke up.

Nukes that Ukraine built and were stored in Ukraine still belonged to Russia.

I bet if Ukraine builds some more you'll claim Russia owns them too.

Soviet nuclear weapons were designed and assembled at the secret Arzamas-16 laboratory, near Moscow, and then finished at the KB-11 Installation in the secret city of Sarov:
Arzamas-16
This laboratory was established in 1945 and was similar to Los Alamos. It was led by Igor Kurchatov, who made progress on a bomb using plutonium after receiving British data.
KB-11 Installation
This installation was located in Sarov, which is now known as the All-Russian Scientific Research Institute of Experimental Physics.

 

[holdover]

Utterly ridiculous.

NATO started this war by
(checks notes) acting too friendly to Ukraine ?

If that's true, then surely NATO would be justified in steamrolling through Belarus because they're too friendly with Russia, right ?

Ridiculous.? Thats rich. the CNN version , Russia invaded Ukraine for no good reason , except maybe to take over ALL of Europe.

Thats like a 5th grader understanding of what happened Ive tried to explain the history of the conflict which goes back decades but it never took . You dont want to hear it . You dont want to hear the the agreement to leave the soviet Union in 91 required an agreemnt that Ukraine would never join NATO. You dont want to hear it was written in thier constituion, You dont want to hear that CIA coup of Ukraine installed a puppet , You dont want to hear Zelenski was ready to give the black sea fleet over to NATO , You dont want to hear that John Mcain and friends armed and trained Ukraine to the teeth , You dont want to hear that Putin explained tens of times if Ukraine joined NATO it would mean war , You dont want to hear that Putin offered a peaceplan several times right before the war started ,You dont want to hear plans to break up Russia into several states was planned by the west .You dont want hear that Angela Merkle stated publicicly that they never intended to honer the agreement it was just to buy time to arm Ukraine( Almost like they knew the war was comming) How old are you guys? 10? Sure sound like it .

Go listen to MSNBC, Russians are bad, Putin is a madman . the world is simple and history and facts means nothing.

 

[holdover]

Minsk agreements had nothing to do with nukes.

Ukraine never had nukes to give up. Soviet nuclear arsenal belonged to Russian Federation as Internationally recognized successor of the Soviet Union along with all of the nuclear treaties made by the Soviet Union.

You cant argue history with sombody that parrots CNN talking points

 

[holdover]

Just a reminder, the principle part of that agreement was that Ukraine give up their nukes in exchange for security guarantees from Russia and the US.

NO.

 

[holdover]

You're probably correct on that one.

I'm not sure blaming all of NATO for some CIA scheme is quite fair, but the gist of it is right.

But, they setup the bait and Putin fell right into the trap. All he had to do was keep his troops on his own side or the border.

So, regardless or what manipulation the CIA was engaging in, the actual crime here was the invasion, and that is 100% on Putin.

He did keep his troops on his side of the border from 2014-2022. After screaming for thirty fucking years that the expansion of NATO into Ukraine was unacceptable to the national security of the Russian state , warning after warning after warning the CIA Puppet decided it was a good idea , then Russia in a surprise attack for no good reason decided to attack Ukraine and take over Europe What a bunch of bullshit. You believed WMD's in Iraq too. dont even deny it. You bought it hook line and sinker. the reason is telling, You dont study or research .